Former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton is once again professor
Hillary Clinton as a professor of practice at Columbia University's
newly launched Institute of Global Politics. Teaching alongside the
Dean, who said their focus is inspiring future foreign policy leaders
and thinkers to collaborate around solving the world's most pressing
problems. What we want to see is an act generation of leaders that
They know they understand how to lead in a polarized society because
they will feel that They got the skills here to learn to disagree
with one another respectfully to persuade to build consensus to hear
different views to really listen to question their own assumptions.
That's what leadership will look like in the future. I spoke with
Secretary Clinton in an exclusive interview this morning about her
new role that bridges the worlds of academia and public service.
Secretary Clinton. Thank you so much for making time for us. We appreciate
it. Thank you, Jeff. Good to talk to you. It was the 19 seventies
when you were last a professor at the University of Arkansas Law
School. What's it like to be back in the classroom? And what was
the intention behind taking on this new role? First of all, it's
incredibly exciting. And, um, I was offered this opportunity to Uh,
V, a professor here at Columbia University. And I was very intrigued
because, you know, having been in the Senate having been secretary
of State, having literally travel millions of miles, um I want to
know what was on young people's minds and what they were thinking
about the world. I also wanted to find out if there were more effective
ways in talking about the challenges that we confront whether it's
the war in Ukraine or climate change, whatever it might be. And I
thought there couldn't be a better way than to stand up in front
of 375 young people every week with my co teacher, the dean of the
school, uh, Karen Yorkie, Millo to really figure out what kids are
thinking. What young people worry about. It helps me understand sort
of how young people are thinking about these issues because I'll
tell you, Jeff, before I started teaching. You know, I kept hearing
like, you know, they didn't want to talk about difficult subjects.
They wanted trigger warnings. You know, I haven't seen any of that.
This has been a very thoughtful and for me, uh, enriching experience.
Your courses focused on foreign policy decision making. And when
you were secretary of state, you focused a lot on Asia and the growing
threat that China presented. Now we see the Biden administration
trying to contain China trying to develop more relationships, stronger
relationships in the Indo pus. Defict is calling for greater stability
in the region. What's your assessment of the threat that China poses
as it amasses more military and scientific and technological strength?
Well, I think it poses potentially a very great threat. Uh, first
and foremost in its region, starting with Taiwan, but not ending
there. Clearly, China has demonstrated an aggressive approach. And
they have, as you said, invested a lot of money in a blue water,
navy creating, you know much more. Capacity.
What we're hoping is that we can manage the relationship So, yes,
we have competition. We will have competition and strategic competition.
And we should. I mean there's nothing wrong with that, but we will
not tip over by intention or accident into conflict. Much of that
depends upon the current Chinese leadership. And once they leader
decides to stay for life, uh You know, That's not a good sign. As
we talked about America's role in the world that continued funding
and assistance for Ukraine is now a point of contention on Capitol
Hill. How do you think Vladimir Putin is eyeing the growing political
divide? Over the Ukraine issue in this country. I think Putin is
not only thrilled by the divide over whether we continue and at what
levels to fund Ukraine. I think he is fomenting it as well. Putin
and his team that does the kind of interventions covert and overt
aiming to undermine democracy and to suborn political leaders. Is
a big part of how he sees his role. So when I see people parroting
Russian talking points that first showed up on Russia today, or first
showed up in a speech from a Russian official, you know that's a
big points scored for Putin when I see Americans in positions of
responsibility. Ah, talking about how you know we shouldn't support
the people of Ukraine. You know they're corrupt, I think, Yeah, they
are working very hard to be transparent and accountable and talk
about corruption. You know there is there is the master of corruption.
Ah, living in the Kremlin. So there's a ideological and sadly partisan
political Divide, and I know that the majority of Congress, uh, is
still in favor of supporting Ukraine. So we've got to get through
this period. We have to pass legislation, uh, and continue to support
And you know, Jeff, this This fight is our fight. Honestly, I don't
understand any American siding with Putin. But we've seen it and
we've heard it and we have to fight against it. As we talked about
Congress. There's this effort now led by Republican congressman Matt
Gates to oust House Speaker Kevin McCarthy. Does Congressman McCarthy
Speaker McCarthy does he deserve to keep his job as speaker? And
should Democrats helped bail him out? Well, I'm gonna let Hakeem
Jeffries and his caucus decide that. But I was pleasantly surprised
that the speaker did the right thing when he made common cause with
those As we like to say, grown up members of his own Republican caucus
and Democrats to keep the government open. I would hope that that
kind of mature leadership isn't punished by the most extreme members
of his caucus. So how the Democrats play this and they have a couple
of different options is for you know for them to decide. But I think
McCarthy did the right thing for the country. And isn't that a good
thing to be able to say he did the right thing for the country? On
this matter of extremists within the GOP president Biden has said
that the Trump Republicans the mega Republicans, as he puts it are
semi fascists. Auret Arian strain in the Republican Party. Do you
see it that way? And what's the best way to remedy that if you do
see it, though, I do see it that way. And I'm not. Um, you know,
I'm not happy about saying that, and I know President Biden wasn't
happy because it sounds so discordant to you know our ears. How could
we be growing a kind of authoritarian political force inside our
country? The people who are the leadership level of all of that both
elected and unelected, um, are promoting lies and, uh, being incredibly
divisive and Frankly being loyal to a wannabe dictator.
And how did we get here? I don't. I don't know all the answers. Lots
of people are writing books about that. But I do know you have to
do several things. You have to defeat those people at the polls,
and there is nothing more important than sending a resounding message.
Let's get back to regular politics. You and I can agree or disagree
as Democrats and Republicans from different regions of our country,
different kinds. Of points of view. But let's get back to having
a fact based political discussion where You know? Okay. What? What
do you think about climate change and how we're going to deal with
it or what do you think about our economy and how we're going to
grow it? Let's have that kind of discussion. But let's move away
from, you know the lies and the personal attacks and the kind of
nonsense moves like impeaching Joe Biden for nothing simply because
you disagree with him politically. You know, I was in the Senate.
As you know, for eight years. If you have ideas, speaking to the
House extremists if you have ideas about how we should govern our
country. Do the work you were elected to do. Have committee meetings,
Markup legislation take votes, then work to try to reconcile. Whatever
the Senate comes up with. That's what used to happen. The so called
regular order, so so go to work, You know, don't be, you know, walking
around, you know, engaging in, you know, Twitter fights and insults
and personal attacks. That's you know, that is not the way we're
supposed to govern ourselves. It's no way for a great country to
behave. When you say part of the solution lies in defeating those
people at the polls is the Biden Harris ticket. The best ticket to
do that? You know, people ask me all the time, and they particularly
asked me. Um, well, you think his age is a legitimate issue? Of course,
it's a legitimate issue. But the outcome of the question to me is
okay. That's a factor and let's look at everything else. Maybe people
don't want to rebuild our infrastructure and deal with all of our,
you know, physical decay, But I do and Joe Biden does. Maybe we don't
want to compete with China on building chips. Factories advanced
manufacturing in this country, but I do. Maybe we don't want to move
toward a clean energy future as quickly as I think we need to. I
like that. He got that done by any measure. The accomplishments of
the Biden Harris administration are popping and they are laying the
groundwork for a richer, more secure country, with more people having
an opportunity to go as far as their hard work and talent will take
them, and I'm for them on the merits, But I'm also for them because
the alternative Is so dark. And dystopian.
To undermine the rule of law to destroy our institutions to pull
us out of NATO, doing Putin's bidding to be unwilling to stand up
for the real American values to put one person above the country.
None of that is American. So I think that Biden Harris deserves to
be reelected, and I think we have to re elect them, given what the
alternative is. What's your assessment of the Republican field? Nikki
Haley said that you inspired her. Into politics and run for office.
And then there's this question of Donald Trump for indictments. And
yet he's 40 points ahead of his nearest rival. What do you think
accounts for that? It's you know, psychological and emotional. Um,
a big part of the Republican base feels a connection to Trump. Uh,
I still believe sitting here today he will be their nominee no matter
how hard others may try to distinguish themselves. And I think it's
a very, um sad
Commentary on what people are looking for in a leader because
Everything that he allegedly stands for is at odds with so much of
what has made this country work for a long time, overcome many of
our shortcomings and obstacles. And it seems almost impossible to
break through that 40% that is wedded to him as the next president,
So I think we have to do a better job and reaching out to everybody
else who is potential potentially reachable. You know, talking about
you know what kind of life they want for themselves, their Children
and their grandchildren and who's more likely to deliver it. You
know, there's all of these projects being announced all over the
country. Donald Trump talked about infrastructure endlessly never
did a thing about it. Joe Biden didn't talk as much but got it done.
So if you want a good job if you want a Big potential opportunity
to grow the area. You're living in particular rural areas because
a lot of these projects are going into areas that have, you know
real needs. Joe Biden has delivered for you, but it's the emotional
psychological cultural connection to someone who really has, unfortunately,
AH manipulated social media. And also some main so called mainstream
media in a way that people believe what he says to them, and that's
hard to break. It's like being in a cult almost and so I know the
Republicans running against him or trying very hard. I don't think
they're going to be successful given where we are so then I think
it's imperative on the country to once again defeat Trump and elect
Biden. Final question, because I know your time is short in preparing
to speak with you. I spoke to some of your supporters. Even some
people who worked on your campaign and the question they asked me
to ask you is, Is she okay? And I think what they meant was Is she
at peace? Does she feel fulfilled? After the I would imagine the
trauma was pretty traumatic? Yeah. How are you doing Personally,
I'm doing great. And I appreciate uh, that question because I get
asked all the time And I always say, you know, personally, I'm great.
I'm worried about our country and the World and it always reminds
me of what my dear friend and the first woman secretary of state
used to say when she would speak about all the problems we have and
cheat. She wrote a book. Called Fascism, which was a warning to the
United States. I'm talking about Madeleine Albright and she fled
the Nazis with their family. Then she fled the Communist. She kind
of knows what she's talking about. So she would give these you know,
very serious talks. And then somebody invariably would say, But Secretary
Albright, are you an optimist? Here's what she would say. And here's
what I now say. Yes, I'm an optimist who worries a lot, noted Secretary
of State Hillary Clinton. Thank you so much for your time. And congratulations
on the launch of the Institute of Global Politics. Thank you very
much.