>>> CAPPTAIN LUIS AVILA A U.S.
SOLDIER SEVERELY WOUNDED BY AN
I.E.D. EXPLOSION SEPTEMBER 2011
IN AFGHANISTAN USES MUSIC
THERAPY.
CAPTAIN AVILA WILL NOW JOIN THE
JOINT SERVICE QUARTET IN
SINGING "GOD BLESS AMERICA."
>> THAT WAS A MOVING MOMENT
DURING A WELCOME CEREMONY FOR
THE CHAIRMAN OF THE JOINT CHIEFS
MARK MILLEY BACK IN 2019 BUT IT
TURNS OUT THAT IT MAY HAVE BEEN
THE INITIAL MOMENT THAT CHAIRMAN
MILLEY GAINED INSIGHT INTO THE
FORMER PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP'S
VIEW OF MEMBERS OF THE MILITARY.
ACCORDING TO A STUNNING NEW
PROFILE IN THE ATLANTIC
FOLLOWING WOUNDED ARMY CAPTAIN
LUIS AVILA'S RENDITION OF "GOD
BLESS AMERICA" TRUMP WALKED OVER
TO CONGRATULATE AND EMBRACE HIM
BUT MOMENTS AFTER THAT THE
FORMER PRESIDENT TOLD CHAIRMAN
MILLEY, QUOTE, WHY DO YOU BRING
PEOPLE LIKE THAT HERE?
NO ONE WANTS TO SEE THAT.
THE WOUNDED.
NEVER LET AVILA APPEAR IN PUBLIC
AGAIN, TRUMP TOLD MILLEY.
JOINING ME NOW IS
EDITOR-IN-CHIEF OF THE ATLANTIC
JEFFERY GOLD THE AUTHOR OF THAT
PROFILE.
"THE PATRIOT" HOW GENERAL MARK
MILLEY PROTECTED THE
CONSTITUTION FROM DONALD TRUMP.
THAT MOMENT, JEFFERY, IS A
SEARING MOMENT JUST RECOUNTED ON
PAPER.
BUT WHAT WAS IT LIKE TO HEAR
MILLEY RECOUNT THAT TO YOU?
>> I AM NOT GOING TO SAY HOW HE
REACTED TO ALL THESE THINGS OR
WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT
SPECIFICALLY BUT THERE WERE A
LOT OF WITNESSES TO THAT AND I
THINK IT'S TRUE THAT FOR MARK
MILLEY LIKE A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO
WORKED IN AND AROUND THAT
ADMINISTRATION IT WAS A GRADUAL,
FOR SOME NOT SO GRADUAL PROCESS
OF LEARNING ABOUT THE CHARACTER
AND PROCLIVITIES OF THE FORMER
PRESIDENT.
I THINK THAT WAS A MOMENT THAT
WAS DEEPLY UNNATURAL FOR
AMERICAN MILITARY LEADERS NOT
JUST MARK MILLEY BECAUSE THEY
VENERATE VETERANS AND COMBAT
SURVIVORS LIKE CAPTAIN AVILA.
THEY HAVE A UNIVERSAL RESPECT
AND ADMIRATION AND SYMPATHY OF
GENERALS.
THE IDEA YOU WOULD HIDE THEM IS,
IT RUNS, IT IS REPUGNANT AND
RUNS COUNTER TO THEIR INSTINCTS.
>> THEN AGAIN TRUMP IS STILL THE
SAME PERSON WHO TOLD JOHN
McCAIN, YOU KNOW, HE IS NOT A
HERO BECAUSE HE WAS PA PASTOR
>> I DON'T THINK MARK MILLEY
WHEN HE CAME IN 2019 THOUGHT HE
WAS DEALING WITH MR. ROGERS BUT
THE INTERESTING THING ABOUT THE
PROGRESSION, BY THE WAY IT TOOK
UNTIL LAFAYETTE SQUARE THE NEXT
YEAR FOR MARK MILLEY TO FULLY
UNDERSTAND WHAT HE IS DEALING
WITH HERE.
YOU KNOW, IN TERMS OF THE
PRESIDENT.
VERY, VERY HARD THING FOR HIM TO
DO BECAUSE THAT IS THE
COMMANDER-IN-CHIEF.
>> ONE OF THE THINGS YOU NOTE IN
THIS PIECE IS THAT TRUMP PICKED
MILLEY BECAUSE HE THOUGHT HE
LOOKED LIKE A GENERAL.
HE IS A BIG GUY.
HE'S GOT A GENERAL'S FACE.
>> YES.
>> SQUARE.
BIG EYEBROWS.
WHAT IS HE REALLY LIKE?
HOW DID THAT FACTOR INTO WHETHER
THEY WERE ABLE TO BE COMPATIBLE?
>> WE KNOW PEOPLE THAT COVERED
TRUMP KNOW HE ALWAYS HAS THIS
LINE. THAT GUY LOOKS OUT OF CENTRAL
CASTING.
RIGHT?
HE CASTS PEOPLE FOR ROLES.
HE DOESN'T INTERVIEW THEM PER
SE, THAT YOU LOOK LIKE A
SECRETARY OF STATE.
YOU LOOK LIKE A CHAIRMAN OF THE
JOINT CHIEFS.
WHAT HE DIDN'T UNDERSTAND
BENEATH THAT TANK LIKE BILL, WAS
A PRINCETON EDUCATED HISTORIAN.
NOT ONLY THAT WHAT HE DIDN'T
UNDERSTAND AND THIS IS WRT
RELATIONSHIP FELL APART AS IT
DID WITH A LOT OF OTHER PEOPLE,
JIM MATTIS AND JOHN KELLY, OTHER
GENERALS WHO CAME IN BECAUSE
MAYBE IN PART THEY LOOKED THE
PART. WHAT HE DIDN'T UNDERSTAND WAS
MARK MILLEY WAS COMMITTED TO THE
PRINCIPLE THAT THE MILITARY
REPORTS IN ESSENCE TO THE
CONSTITUTION.
NOT TO THE PRESIDENT OF THE
UNITED STATES.
HE DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THESE GUYS
WHO HAVE RISEN IN THE RANKS TO
GENERAL HAVE THEIR OWN CODE OF
CONDUCT AND ETHICS AND BEHAVIOR
THAT RAN COUNTER TO WHAT TRUMP
THOUGHT MAYBE BASED ON WHAT HE
SAW IN MOVIES, HOW HE THOUGHT HE
SHOULD ACT.
AND SO IT WAS A CLASH ALMOST
FROM THE BEGINNING.
AS IT WAS WITH A LOT OF OTHER
PEOPLE THAT TRUMP HIRED.
JEFFREY, ONE OF THE STUNNING
THINGS IN THIS PIECE IS THAT
MILLEY TOLD YOU THAT IF TRUMP
IS ELECTED AGAIN, HE THINKS
THAT, QUOTE, TRUMP WILL START
THROWING PEOPLE IN JAIL, I MEAN
THE TOP OF THE LIST.
>> HE HAS TOLD THAT TO SOME OF
HIS FRIENDS AND VARIOUS PEOPLE.
THIS IS NOT SURPRISING, IN A
WAY.
IF YOU RECALL A LITTLE WHILE
BACK, TRUMP TOLD SOME OF HIS
SUPPORTERS IN A RALLY, I AM
GOING TO BE RETRIBUTION.
BY THAT, HE ALSO MEANS, I'M
GOING TO GET MY REVENGE ON THE
PEOPLE.
>> HE WANTS HIS RETRIBUTION FOR
MILLEY FOR WHAT?
>> HE THINKS THAT MILLEY, LIKE
OTHER PEOPLE IN THE
ADMINISTRATION, SUBVERTED HIS
TRUMP PLATFORM.
THE WHOLE MARKET PLATFORM.
HE THINKS THAT THE MILITARY
SERVED HIM, RIGHT?
HE DID NOT TAKE THAT CIVICS
COURSE THAT MANY OF US TOOK
THAT SAID THAT THE MILITARY IS
THERE TO UPHOLD THE
CONSTITUTION.
IT DOESN'T WORK.
IF YOU REPORT TO THE
COMMANDER-IN-CHIEF --
IF THE COMMANDER TELLS YOU TO
DO SOMETHING THAT IS ILLEGAL OR
IMMORAL, YOU DON'T DO IT, RIGHT?
IT IS NOT JUST MILLEY ITS
PROBLEM.
THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO
WORKED FOR DONALD TRUMP AND
UNDERSTAND THAT IF TRUMP GOES
BACK INTO POWER, TRUMP WILL TRY
TO USE THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT,
STAFFED WITH HIS OWN PEOPLE,
TRY TO USE THE JUSTICE
DEPARTMENT TO PROSECUTE THEM.
FOR WHAT?
WE DON'T KNOW.
THE DETAILS ARE ALWAYS HARD TO
UNDERSTAND.
>> A KEY MOMENT FOR MILLEY.
WE ELECTED TO THIS EARLIER,
THIS LAUGH AT SQUARE MOMENT
DURING THE GEORGE --
GEORGE FLOYD PROTEST.
HE'S WALKING WITH TRUMP TO
CERTAIN POINT.
HE SAYS, ABSOLUTELY POSITIVELY
SHOULD HAVE BEEN THERE.
THAT ALSO, IT SEEMS TO ME, A
SERIOUS MOMENT FOR HIM.
>> IT WAS A PIVOT MOMENT IN HIS
LIFE, RIGHT?
I CANNOT GO WHERE THIS GUY
WANTS ME TO GO.
REMEMBER, AT THE SAME TIME,
THERE IS ALSO DISCOURSE IN THE
WHITE HOUSE.
TRUMP ASKED MILLEY AND ESPER,
THE DEFENSE SECRETARY, WHY
CAN'T YOU JUST SHOOT THEM, THE
DEMONSTRATORS, IN THE LEGS?
THEY'RE LIKE, BECAUSE IT IS
AMERICA, WE DON'T DO THAT, WE
DON'T TAKE THE MILITARY.
WE DON'T HAVE THEM OUT OF THE
STREETS AND SHOOT PEOPLE YOU
DON'T LIKE IN THE LEGS.
THIS IS AN INTERESTING THING.
YOU HEAR THIS OVER NO
FORGETTING.
TRUMP DOESN'T UNDERSTAND.
HE DOESN'T UNDERSTAND THAT
CONCEPT THAT IT IS NOT WHAT THE
MILITARY IS THERE.
FOUR IS NOT WHY THEY JOIN.
IT'S NOT WHAT THEIR OATH SAYS.
>> HE LITERALLY SAYS HERE, THIS
IS A NEW PIECE.
YOU GUYS, REFERRING TO COMBAT
SOLDIERS, ARE ALL KILLERS.
WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE?
>> HERE, WE'RE TALKING A WHILE
AGO ABOUT WHO MILLEY IS.
IT'S, LIKE HE'S A BIG CALM
VETERAN, A HOCKEY PLAYER
GROWING UP.
HE IS ALSO A SERIOUS CATHOLIC.
HE'S A SERIOUS INTELLECTUAL WHO
READS HISTORY.
HE'S A SERIOUS STUDENT OF THE
CONSTITUTION.
THOSE ARE THE PARTS THAT TRUMP
DIDN'T SEE.
>> DIDN'T SEE, DIDN'T
UNDERSTAND, DIDN'T CARE FOR.
JEFFREY GOLDBERG, THANK YOU
VERY MUCH FOR GOING THROUGH ALL
OF THAT FOR US.