ROOM, ABOUT TO BE SEATED AGAIN. HE WILL REMAIN SWORN IN.
>>> THE GENTLEMAN FROM
LOUISIANA.
LOUISIANA. >> THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN.
MR. MUELLER, CONGRESSMAN
ADDRESSED TRUMP’S ADDRESS TO
McGAHN TO FIRE YOU.
REPRESENTATIVE BASS TALKED ABOUT
THE PRESIDENT’S REQUEST OF
McGAHN TO DENY THE FACT THAT THE
PRESIDENT MADE THAT REQUEST.
I WANT TO PICK UP WHERE THEY
LEFT OFF, AND IT TO PICK UP WITH
THE PRESIDENT’S PERSONAL LAWYER.
IN FACT, THERE WAS EVIDENCE THAT
THE PRESIDENT’S PERSONAL LAWYER
WAS ALARMED AT THE PROSPECT OF
THE PRESIDENT MEETING WITH MR.
McGAHN TO DISCUSS MR. McGAHN’S
REFUSAL TO DENY THE "NEW YORK
TIMES" REPORT ABOUT THE
PRESIDENT TRYING TO FIRE YOU,
CORRECT.
CORRECT. >> CORRECT.
>> CORRECT. >> IN FACT, THE PRESIDENT’S
COUNSEL WAS SO ALARMED BY THE
PROSPECT OF THE PRESIDENT’S
MEETING WITH McGAHN THAT HE
CALLED MR. McGAHN’S COUNSEL AND
SAID THAT McGAHN COULD NOT
RESIGN NO MATTER WHAT HAPPENED
IN THE OVAL OFFICE THAT DAY,
CORRECT?
CORRECT? >> CORRECT.
>> CORRECT. >> SO IT’S ACCURATE TO SAY THAT
THE PRESIDENT KNEW THAT HE WAS
ASKING McGAHN TO DENY FACTS THAT
McGAHN, "HAD REPEATEDLY SAID
WERE ACCURATE," ISN’T THAT
RIGHT.
RIGHT. >> CORRECT.
>> CORRECT. >> YOUR INVESTIGATION ALSO
FOUND, "BY THE TIME OF THE OVAL
OFFICE MEETING WITH THE
PRESIDENT, THE PRESIDENT WAS
AWARE, ONE, THAT McGAHN DID NOT
THINK THE STORY WAS FALSE, TWO,
DID NOT WANT TO ISSUE A
STATEMENT OR CREATE A WRITTEN
RECORD DENYING FACTS THAT McGAHN
BELIEVED TO BE TRUE.
THE PRESIDENT NEVERTHELESS
PERSISTED AND ASKED McGAHN TO
REPUDIATE FACTS THAT McGAHN HAD
REPEATEDLY SAID WAS ACCURATE.
; ISN’T THAT CORRECT.
>> GENERALLY TRUE.
>> I BELIEVE THAT’S ON PAGE 119.
THANK YOU.
THANK YOU. IN OTHER WORDS, THE PRESIDENT
WAS TRYING TO FORCE McGAHN TO
SAY SOMETHING THAT McGAHN DID
NOT BELIEVE TO BE TRUE.
>> THAT’S ACCURATE.
>> I WANT TO REFERENCE YOU TO A
SLIDE, AND IT’S ON PAGE 120.
AND IT SAYS, SUBSTANTIAL
EVIDENCE INDICATES THAT IN
REPEATEDLY URGING McGAHN TO
DISPUTE THAT HE WAS ORDERED TO
HAVE THE SPECIAL COUNSEL
TERMINATED, THE PRESIDENT ACTED
FOR THE PURPOSE OF INFLUENCING
McGAHN’S ACCOUNT IN ORDER TO
DEFLECT OR PREVENT FURTHER
SCRUTINY OF THE PRESIDENT’S
CONDUCT TOWARDS THE
INVESTIGATION.
INVESTIGATION. >> THAT’S ACCURATE.
>> CAN YOU EXPLAIN WHAT YOU
MEANT THERE?
MEANT THERE? >> I JUST AM GOING TO LEAVE IT
AS IT APPEARS IN THE REPORT.
>> IS SO IT’S FAIR TO SAY THE
PRESIDENT TRIED TO PROTECT
HIMSELF BY ASKING STAFF TO
FALSIFY RECORDS RELEVANT TO AN
ONGOING INVESTIGATION.
ONGOING INVESTIGATION. >> I WOULD SAY THAT’S GENERALLY
THE SUMMARY.
THE SUMMARY. >> WOULD YOU SAY THAT THAT
ACTION, THE PRESIDENT TRIED TO
HAMPER THE INVESTIGATION BY
ASKING STAFF TO FALSIFY RECORDS
RELEVANT TO YOUR INVESTIGATION.
>> I’M GOING TO JUST REFER YOU
TO THE REPORT IF I COULD FOR
REVIEW OF THAT EPISODE.
>> THANK YOU.
ALSO, THE PRESIDENT’S ATTEMPT TO
GET McGAHN TO CREATE A FALSE
WRITTEN RECORD WERE RELATED TO
MR. TRUMP’S CONCERNS ABOUT YOUR
OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE INQUIRY,
CORRECT?
CORRECT? >> I BELIEVE THAT TO BE TRUE.
>> IN FACT, AT THAT SAME OVAL
OFFICE MEETING, DID THE
PRESIDENT ALSO ASK McGAHN WHY HE
HAD TOLD, QUOTE WHY HE HAD TOLD
SPECIAL COUNSEL’S OFFICE
INVESTIGATORS THAT THE PRESIDENT
TOLD HIM TO HAVE YOU REMOVED"?
.
. >> AND WHAT WAS THE QUESTION,
SIR, IF I MIGHT?
>> LET ME GO TO THE NEXT ONE.
THE PRESIDENT "CRITICIZED McGAHN
FOR TELLING YOUR OFFICE ABOUT
THE JUNE 17th, 2017 EVENTS WHEN
HE TOLD McGAHN TO HAVE YOU
REMOVED, CORRECT?
REMOVED, CORRECT? >> CORRECT.
>> CORRECT. >> IN OTHER WORDS, THE PRESIDENT
WAS CRITICIZING HIS WHITE HOUSE
COUNSEL FOR TELLING LAW
ENFORCEMENT OFFICIALS WHAT HE
BELIEVED TO BE THE TRUTH.
>> I, AGAIN, GO BACK TO THE TEXT
OF THE REPORT.
>> WELL, LET ME GO A LITTLE BIT
FURTHER.
FURTHER. WOULD IT HAVE BEEN A CRIME IF
MR. McGAHN HAD LIED TO YOU ABOUT
THE PRESIDENT ORDERING HIM TO
FIRE YOU?
FIRE YOU? >> I DON’T WANT TO SPECULATE.
>> OKAY.
>> OKAY. IS IT TRUE THAT YOU CHARGED
MULTIPLE PEOPLE ASSOCIATED WITH
THE PRESIDENT FOR LYING TO YOU
DURING YOUR INVESTIGATION?
>> THAT IS ACCURATE.
>> THE PRESIDENT ALSO COMPLAINED
THAT HIS STAFF WERE TAKING NOTES
DURING THE MEETING ABOUT FIRING
McGAHN; IS THAT CORRECT?
>> THAT’S WHAT THE REPORT SAYS.
YEAH, THE REPORT.
>> BUT, IN FACT, IT IS
COMPLETELY APPROPRIATE FOR THE
PRESIDENT’S STAFF, ESPECIALLY
HIS COUNSEL’S, TO TAKE NOTES
DURING A MEETING, CORRECT?
>> I RELY ON THE WORDING OF THE
REPORT.
REPORT. >> WELL, THANK YOU, DIRECTOR
MUELLER, FOR YOUR INVESTIGATION
INTO WHETHER THE PRESIDENT
ATTEMPTED TO OBSTRUCT JUSTICE BY
ORDERING HIS WHITE HOUSE COUNSEL
DON McGAHN TO LIE TO PROTECT THE
PRESIDENT AND THEN TO CREATE A
FALSE RECORD ABOUT IT.
IT IS CLEAR THAT ANY OTHER
PERSON WHO ENGAGED IN SUCH
CONDUCT WOULD BE CHARGED WITH A
CRIME.
CRIME. WE WILL CONTINUE OUR