>>> WELCOME BACK. WE ARE JUST ABOUT 27 HOURS AWAY
FROM THE FIRST DEBATE OF THE
2020 DEMOCRATIC PRIMARY SEASON.
YOU ONLY GET ONE CHANCE TO MAKE
A FIRST IMPRESSION.
THAT’S JUST WHAT THE FIRST
DEBATE WILL BE FOR SEVERAL
CANDIDATES.
CANDIDATES. JOINING ME IS SOMEONE WHO KNOWS
ABOUT PRESIDENTIAL DEBATES,
FORMER VERMONT GOVERNOR HOWARD
DEAN.
DEAN. IF HE WAS ON A STAGE AS A AN
PRESIDENTIAL CYCLE AND OVERSAW
THE ENTIRE PROCESS AS DNC CHARNL
FOUR YEARS LATER.
GOOD TO SEE YOU.
I’VE HAD A THEORY ABOUT THIS
FIRST DEBATE WHICH IS SIMPLY,
AND I WANT YOU TO HELP US WHAT’S
GOING ON IN THE MINDS OF THE
CANDIDATES.
CANDIDATES. THOSE THAT ARE EXPECTING
FIREWORKS I’M THINKING NOT FROM
THE FRONT-RUNNERS.
THE FRONT-RUNNERS. THEY KNOW THERE’S GOING TO BE
NINE MORE, TEN MORE DEBATES.
WHAT IS GOING ON INSIDE THE HEAD
OF THE FRONT-RUNNERS RIGHT NOW?
>> NOBODY CAN KNOW, BUT I CAN
GUESS.
GUESS. THE IDEA IN THE FRONT-RUNNERS IS
DON’T SAY ANYTHING THAT’S GOING
TO GET YOU IN TROUBLE.
HAVE YOU NICE LEADS.
YOU’RE IN THE TOP TIER.
YOU GOT TO BE SUBSTANTIVE AND
YOU’VE GOT TO BE GENUINE BUT YOU
DON’T WANT TO BE CONTROVERSIAL.
>> YOU ALSO THOUGH, WHAT MAKES
THIS DEBATE DIFFERENT IS HOW
MANY NONTOP TIER CANDIDATES
THERE ARE, AND SOME OF THEM THIS
IS THEIR LAST SHOT.
RIGHT?
RIGHT? WE KNOW THERE ARE OTHER
CANDIDATES ACTIVELY TRYING TO
QUALIFY FOR THE NEXT DEBATE.
ONE OR TWO MAY NOT -- THAT ARE
GET TO DO THIS TOMORROW AND
THURSDAY MAY NOT EVER GET ON A
DEBATE STAGE AGAIN.
WHAT’S GOING THROUGH THEIR MIND?
>> THEY HAVE TO STAND OUT IN
SOME WAY AND THE ADVICE THAT I
HAVE GIVEN PUBLICLY SINCE I’M
NEUTRAL AND NOT ADVISING ANYBODY
IN PARTICULAR, DON’T GIVE LONG
POLICY SPEECHES.
POLICY SPEECHES. THAT’S NOT GOING TO HELP YOU.
GIVE US SOMETHING SPECIFIC YOU
CARE ABOUT IT AND DO IT MORE
THAN ONCE.
THAN ONCE. YOU ONLY GET SEVEN MINUTES OUT
OF THE HOUR AND A HALF.
AND SECONDLY, IF YOU ATTACK THE
FRONT-RUNNER YOUR NUMBERS WILL
GO UP A LITTLE BIT AND YOUR
NEGATIVES GO UP A LOT.
YOU CAN’T DO IT THAT WAY.
>> YOU’RE SAYING JUST BASHING
BIDEN ISN’T THE BEST -- THAT
ISN’T WHAT YOU WOULD BE TELLING
ERIC SWALWELL TO DO.
HAVE A POINT IN WHAT YOU’RE
DOING.
DOING. >> ACTUALLY BASHING ANYBODY.
I DON’T MEAN THE FRONT-RUNNER
BIDEN.
BIDEN. THE FRONT-RUNNERS, TOP TIER
CANDIDATES.
CANDIDATES. THIS IS A DEMOCRATIC PARTY WHOSE
MAJOR TWO-THIRDS OF THE
DEMOCRATS WANT SOMEBODY WHO CAN
BE BEAT TRUMP AND WILLING TO
SACRIFICE ANYTHING ELSE IN ORDER
TO GET SOMEBODY WHO CAN BEAT
TRUMP.
TRUMP. YOU WON’T GET POINTS FOR CALLING
THEM OUT BY NAME.
YOU’LL GET IN TROUBLE.
IRONICALLY, THIS IS FUNNY
BECAUSE YOU WOULDN’T WORK ON THE
DEMOCRATIC SIDE.
DEMOCRATIC SIDE. THE MIDDLE EAST MEMORABLE DEBATE
ON THE REPUBLICAN SIDE OVER THE
LAST FEW YEARS IS 999.
HERMAN CAIN WENT TO THE TOP OF
THE PRIMARY PAC AFTER THAT
DEBATE.
DEBATE. HE OBVIOUSLY DIDN’T WIN THE
NOMINATION.
NOMINATION. I WOULDN’T REMEMBER THAT, BUT
SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
>> I’M CURIOUS, DO YOU SEE
PARALLELS IN YOUR PRIMARY IN ’04
VERSUS WHAT WE’RE SEEING NOW?
I SAY IT THIS WAY.
YOU KNOW, YOU WERE THE
INSURGENT.
INSURGENT. YOU WERE THE OUTSIDER GOING YOU
GOT TO TAKE IT TO BUSH.
YOU GOT TO GO AT HIM.
YOU HAD OTHERS IN THE
ESTABLISHMENT GOING NO, NO, NO,
YOU NEED SOMEBODY WITH THE
PROPER RESUME, JOHN KERRY HAS
THE PROPER RESUME.
DO YOU SEE SOMETHING HERE
BETWEEN BIDEN AND SAY THE
INSURGENTS IN THIS FIELD?
>> ONLY A LITTLE BIT.
DON’T FORGET, IN MY -- MY SURGE
AS INSURGENT CAME AT THE END OF
JUNE IN 2003 AFTER WE HAD
OUTRAISE RAD JOHN KERRY, THE
FAVORITE.
FAVORITE. I ACTUALLY DIDN’T GET ON THE
DEBATE STAGE TILL I WAS THE
FAVORITE WHICH WAS COMPLETELY --
I WAS BY FAR THE MOST
EXPERIENCED SERIOUS CANDIDATE
WHO WAS RUNNING.
SO FOR ME, IT WAS VERY, VERY
DIFFERENT SITUATION.
DIFFERENT SITUATION. I MADE A FAIR NUMBER OF MISTAKES
WHICH IS WHY I GIVE THE ADVICE I
DO NOW.
DO NOW. BUT YES, I DO THINK THAT THERE’S
ALWAYS THIS WISH AMONG
DEMOCRATIC VOTERS, DO WE GET THE
MOST ELECTABLE PERSON, OR DO WE
GET THE PERSON WE REALLY LOVE.
I THINK YOU’VE GOT TO TEMPER
THAT WITH BOTH IN YOUR -- LOOK,
I THINK THE VOTERS ARE USUALLY
RIGHT.
RIGHT. I’M PRETTY OPTIMISTIC ABOUT OUR
CHANCES.
CHANCES. I DON’T KNOW IF THEY’LL PICK JOE
BIDEN OR SOMEBODY ELSE OR EVEN
SOMEBODY I THINK -- I EXPECT TWO
OR THREE PEOPLE TO COME OUT OF
THE PACK IN THE NEXT TWO NIGHTS
WE HAVEN’T THOUGHT ABOUT YET.
>> I THINK YOU’RE RIGHT.
PEOPLE ARE STILL SHOPPING AND
FOLLOWING TEST DRIVE A LOT OF
CARS EVEN IF THEY END UP WITH
THE SAME SEDAN THEY BOUGHT THREE
CARS IN A ROW.
>> THAT’S TRUE.
>> I AM CURIOUS, WHAT’S YOUR
ADVICE TO BIDEN?
>> DON’T MAKE, TRY NOT TO MAKE
ANY MISTAKES NO, GAFFES.
STAY ON MESSAGE AND SAY
SOMETHING SUBSTANTIVE.
SOMETHING SUBSTANTIVE. >> DOES HE NEED TO DO A LITTLE
BIT OF RISK AND SHOW SOMETHING
HE HASN’T SHOWN YET, OR DO YOU
THINK HE’S GOT TO STAY BEING WHO
HE -- THERE’S SOME PEOPLE WHO
SAY YOU GOT TO REACH OUT TO THIS
GROUP OR THAT GROUP.
AND THERE’S GOING TO BE OTHERS
THAT TELL HIM LOOK, YOUR WHOLE
CANDIDACY IS BASED ON THE
PREMISE OF PEOPLE WANT A
TIME-OUT.
TIME-OUT. SO PLAY INTO THE TIME-OUT.
>> WITHOUT RESPONDING EXACTLY TO
THAT, LET ME SAY WHAT I’VE BEEN
SAYING FOR A LONG TIME.
IF WE ARE TALKING FOUR MONTHS
BEFORE THE ELECTION AFTER WE
HAVE A NOMINEE ABOUT DONALD
TRUMP, WE LOSE.
TRUMP, LET TRUMP TALK ABOUT
TRUMP.
TRUMP. I HOPE THESE THINGS ARE NOT JUST
ABOUT BASHING TRUMP.
WE HAVE TO HAVE A MESSAGE THAT
TALKS ABOUT HEALTH CARE,
ECONOMIC INEQUALITY, EDUCATION.
TRUMP WILL REMIND US WHY WE
DON’T LIKE HIM EVERY DAY.
WE NEED NOT PILE ON OR WE’LL