- Sex is kind of overrated, y'all, I'm just saying.
(group laughs)
- Sex is like cooperative fitness.
You know, it's a great workout. It's good cardio.
I don't need it.
(upbeat music)
- [Interviewer] I fell in love quickly.
I fell in love quickly.
Three, two, one. Go.
- I think you're on that side.
- Yeah?
(group laughs)
- How far do I go though?
- [Interviewer] What's going through your mind?
- A lot of stuff.
(group laughs)
- Like, you know, if I was like six feet tall,
I'd kind of just lay on my side right here
and, like, take this whole row.
But, like, every time I'd hear that phrase of hmm.
You know, I still haven't been able to say it
throughout my entire life.
Even when like, my family would say it to me
or my friends would say it to me
or when my partner would say it to me.
In spite all the training I've done of watching movies,
I still don't register or follow with, like what love means.
You know what. Here we go. Ah, here.
(group laughs)
- I'll just lay down right here.
Actually this floor's dirty. I'm good.
I should not have done that.
- You were talking about not experiencing
what love is supposed to be and I feel like I caught you
in a mental trap that I spent, like, years in.
The thing with media and music and, like, movies
is that we're told, like, "This is what neurotypicals
experience and this is the peak of existence,"
and there's no supposed-to.
Whatever you feel and brings you joy is your path
and that's one of the things that makes our love so unique.
- Actually, I kind of feel like, 'cause I think
what I've talked to Rae earlier about,
I'm more of a shower than a teller.
Like these words of affirmations, like saying things like
"I miss you," is things that I'm not very strong
at talking about and more in my actions
I can show things that I care about you.
You know, like, I'll bring you food.
(group laughs) - Yes.
- Or I will, I'll hug you harder.
And I'll be like, I got you girl.
(group laughing)
- I feel like I definitely found strong feelings
for him quickly.
You did things that were very difficult to ignore,
like write me love poems and share them on stage.
- Just how I did it.
(group laughing)
- I'm not on strongly agree because
we're still figuring out what these feelings mean.
So I'm hesitant to fully-
- Be vulnerable?
- Thank you. Yeah. Hesitant to fully be vulnerable
and it's not a bad thing.
- [Interviewer] Ayumi, I saw you kind of agreeing.
- Yes. I think being on a spectrum sometimes
we just love bomb. I would like write him letters.
I was, like, probably way too much at the beginning.
Like obsessiveness. I, I was just like,
yeah, heart eyes immediately.
- Around a month into us dating,
we were just like talking at In-N-Out, and I,
I fell asleep and he just, like, let me, like, sleep
with, like, my head in his lap.
And I was like, I wanna be with him forever.
But I just kept that to myself
'cause no one says that a month in.
(group laughing)
- [Interviewer] My partner wants more physical intimacy
than me.
Three. Two. One.
- [Ayumi] Intimacy.
- [Interviewer] Okay. We've got a huge split here
between Chai and Rae. I'm curious.
- Well, it's not that I don't like physical intimacy,
but I know clearly Rae definitely likes it more than I do.
Yeah. I did lack a lot of physical intimacy
since in my childhood, I learned physical affection
more through fists than hugs.
What did caught me more was
that there was a certain way that Rae hugged me differently
than the way that I naturally got hugs.
And I'm like, this feels really warm and nice.
(Chai laughs)
- I don't like getting naked.
I feel like sex is kind of overrated, y'all.
I'm just saying sex is like cooperative fitness.
You know, it, it's a great workout.
It's pretty good options. Like it, it ain't a bad thing.
It's a pretty great thing.
I don't need it.
- Yeah. So that's, that's a, a balance that's hard.
That's hard to maintain sometimes.
Hm. I've definitely had to tone back my desire for
for physical interactions.
I get a lot of those needs met through handholding
and hugging, so I'm like basically always hugging Chai.
- It's funny like when I first asked Rae,
may I place my hand into your hand
or can I run my face into your face?
Because I didn't know like how to,
because consent is important.
Y'all like, you know, gotta get that consent.
I need the verbal cues to be like, am I,
may I have your permission to do the things
I'm about to do to you?
So that's kind of why I needed a lot.
Or if she says I'm feeling it, I'm like, I got you.
And she says, I'm not feeling it, I'm gonna turn off.
- It seems that there's a lot of commonalities here.
I've literally heard her say some
of the same words you just said.
She's like, you know, okay, give me your hand.
I'm gonna put my hand in your hand now.
And I'm like, you don't gotta ask for that.
And she's like, okay, I'm gonna hug you.
I'm like, babe, you my like, you like my whole wife.
- It's a awkward thing for me with,
when it comes to physical, 'cause I still to this day
I ask for consent a lot of times
because if this doesn't come naturally, I don't know
I'm like in the middle because sometimes I'm overstimulated.
So he might try to give me affection
and I might be like, ah, you know,
right now is not a good time.
My, my youngest is the the same way.
We get overstimulated really easily.
So she's like, don't touch me, don't hug me, you know?
But sometimes I need a lot of affection.
Sometimes I'm like this, come on, like
you know, comfort me, I need comforting.
And other times I'm like, you know, this is too much.
I don't need that right now.
- Like, I mean, I experience a lot of overstimulation
that basically makes me more inclined to, like, set my skin
on fire than is to, to want to, like, be like in a,
like a romantic, like, touching situation sometimes.
I struggle with the question I guess 'cause it's not me.
That's just like how my body reacts to my environment.
It's not something like I identify with.
It's just, if anything it's just a cause for
for annoyance, which is something that I try not
to do 'cause that really just makes it worse.
But generally I consider myself in like spirit
and personality.
Like I love affection, I love physical intimacy.
It's, it's really good.
And it helps my heart like heal in many, many ways. So.
- [Interviewer] I was nervous to join this relationship.
Three. Two. One.
(Rae laughing)
- I wasn't necessarily looking for a relationship
and I was not aware that Chai was on the spectrum
until we started dating.
I just thought he was awkward.
(group laughing)
- I mean, that's still true.
- Which is still true.
For me I immediately knew that the relationship
was gonna be more difficult
than I thought it was going to be.
But it wasn't a, oh, a make or break deal.
- This was also my first relationship and, you know,
Rae gave me something that not a lot of socially awkward
introverted guys with low self-esteem is that was, you know,
attention and affirmation.
You know, kind of the double-A batteries
for people with low self-esteem.
I forgot what the prompt was. Oh, nervous.
Yeah. Oh yeah. I was so nervous.
(group laughing)
- 'Cause just like how I'm doing it right now, it's,
it's hard because it's a brand new experience for me.
I didn't know what I was doing.
I'm just, let's go and see what happened.
- [Interviewer] I'd love to hear from on this side.
We have some disagrees.
- Well I'm dyslexic so I read the signs wrong.
- [Interviewer] Oh no. - I'm on the wrong side.
- [Interviewer] Go for it. You can move to-
- Oh, I was gonna say I somewhat agree.
At the time when I met Terry, I was in the military
and I didn't know I was on the spectrum,
but I knew there was something going on.
So I was somewhat nervous because I was afraid
that he was gonna think I'm a little weird or different.
'cause I already knew that I am very different than the,
you know, neurotypical person.
- The craziest thing was we discovered her autism
after we discovered our children's
because it was just like, wait a minute, you did that and
and you do that and, and you talk like that,
and you, you know, it was like, oh wow.
Like, and we just started to educate, educate, educate.
So I strongly disagree. And, and some of the, you know
if we want to describe it as quirkiness,
that's what made me fall in love with her.
So I was very rigid, stern, strong, cold.
She was very, you know, what are you talking about?
Let go, you know, and eventually I was able to just let go.
So I think I definitely gained
from being in a relationship with her.
- So I strongly agreed because there was something
so genuine about Connor, it didn't even like register
to me at first that he was autistic too.
The day he told me he loved me, I told my best friend
and she was like, well like what does he want?
And I was like I don't know.
But since then it's been incredible
and he's created such a safe environment for me.
And it's ju, it's the best relationship
and I love him very much. So.
- I remember when we first met, we were at a park
with a bunch of people we barely knew
and we were both stressed about that.
- That's so true. - And we both, like,
- The first time I even caught her eye
we gave each other like a stressed out side glance
from being in the social situation.
I'm like, yeah, yeah, because I tend
I've always gravitated towards people who are not like,
who are not neurotypical and, and I'm like, she's, there's
she's not normal, but it's okay.
(group laughing)
- It's okay.
- [Chai] Ain't nothing wrong with that.
- We had talked a lot about like wanting to find people,
like fi, how we'd wanted to find someone
that we could like open up to
in the face of trauma that we'd both experienced.
And it was at that point I was like, okay.
Like the nervousness will have to come to an end.
And I think this is the person that I want to, like,
retrain my brain into, like, doing that with.
- [Interviewer] I want kids on the spectrum.
Three, two, one. Go.
- That's a hard one. - I know go.
- We have kids on the spectrum.
- I know.
- If I were to like design a baby, I would
I would make changes.
I'm also an engineer and there are things that like
in my life that, like, I don't feel attached to
and if I could, I would change just from, like,
a genetics point of view. So.
- I don't see that there's any fault
in being on the spectrum 'cause this disability is just
that society sees as our inability to communicate
or talk to people that portray our intelligence,
not by our minds, but by the way we speak.
Why wouldn't you want, like, to love your kids?
Whether they're on the spectrum
or any spectrum, any sexuality, any race, gender or whoever.
I suppose mostly my strongly disagree comes
from what the way the world is kind of singing
like going now for our future generations.
So that, that's more of like don't have kids.
I mean, probably not really.
- We have children on the spectrum and man,
being with Ayumi and having kids to discover that
has literally changed my life.
It's changed my patience,
it's changed my observations of self,
it's changed all of the trauma that I grew up with.
You know, like, although it is definitely a learn
as you go experience and I definitely don't have, you know,
a closet full of all wins.
You know, I definitely am grateful for that opportunity.
- They are amazing.
Like literally the most talented little girls ever.
I, I do feel, you know, sad because they do have challenges
with making friends and not being able to, I guess,
be the neurotypical kid
and being able to understand directions right away.
So, I do have to think like, do I want another child to
you know, have to go through that?
So I, I say somewhat agree
because there's a lot of challenges that I had to go
through, that my kids are going through.
So, but amazing people, little humans.
- [Interviewer] I have felt difficult to love.
Three, two, one.
- [Chai] Oh no.
- Okay. I'm gonna make sure I, the questions correct.
I don't know, I just feel like there's a lot of things I,
I have going on, like low self-esteem,
extremely over stimulated, and-
- [Interviewer] Do you want to be
on the strongly disagree line?
- Yeah, I think you might want to come over.
- I think when you're talking- - Yeah.
- Wait, so you're saying- - Do you feel hard-
- Like you're easy to love if you're on that side?
- Oh no.
(group laughing)
- Oh man. Oh look at that.
- Can we start all over?
(group laughing)
- Line's not long enough.
- Okay. We tele, I teleported on this side side.
- We're such unlovable-
(group laughing)
- I'll start from the top.
Okay. So yes, I do feel like I'm very difficult to love.
It's hard to be vulnerable and being on the spectrum
on top of that is just hard for me to communicate
or I might overreact, you know, it's just
I feel like more than the typical person
I have a lot more things going on, so I'm just like
why would somebody love me when I have all these things?
I can't even follow simple directions
or I can't even communicate something.
So I just feel like I have lots of obstacles.
- First I'm going to say that this room should be
a living example of our belief
that we're difficult to love is not real
because everyone probably thinks that way
to some degree and she's easy to love.
She's a great mom and I can sit up here and talk
for hours about why I do love her and how easy it is.
But I also understand she does have the challenges
that she mentioned, but so do I.
I also agree that I'm difficult to love
even though I would hope that she disagrees.
(Ayumi laughs)
- But you know, if you choose to love me, you know, love me
for my strengths and help me through my weak weaknesses.
So that's how I see it.
- So it's funny for me like holding Connor's hand
and being like, I feel hard to love
but autism itself is not the reason for that.
For me, it's other disorders that like,
because I experience a lot of dysregulated emotion,
like unpredictable waves of rage and paranoia
and just things that I think would be stressful
for a person to deal with being with me.
But Connor has been very patient
and I want to make him as happy as I possibly can,
even in the midst of my challenges.
- For me, finding her hard to love
isn't something that I think about.
It's not something that I experience.
I find her easy to love 'cause I love her a lot.
But in my personal experience, like,
the way my brain seems to work is that, like,
if my brain's in the mood to perceive myself
as like not likable or unlovable,
it immediately summons the ghosts of everyone
in my life that I've ever thought displayed that kind
of reaction to anything that I may or may not have done.
And, and so like, I've had much more experience
in that realm than I have in the self help,
like self-love, like, oh, I'm great. Like I'm doing good.
It's been an effort for me to try to retrain my brain
to do less of that for less amount of like,
the time that I'm alive and awake. So.
- Yeah, love is, love is pretty darn hard.
Like, yeah, I don't
I don't see how anyone could have figured this thing out.
So many people feel alone when they're not alone.
Like, you see how lonely that side is
and how unlonely this side is to feeling
like that we are alone. Like, how could this be?
We're, we're, we're all sitting on the same line.
We can't even fit on the same line.
Like y'all would've been right here, but like, there's just
it's just not enough room for people to be alone, you know?
- Yeah, I really wanna be in this line,
but I'm in this line because even though I've
I've expressed feeling not safe or feeling lonely
or feeling like I don't know who to turn to
or who will accept me,
I know that these fillings are transitions
and there's something that I need to find
for myself within them.
I'm trying to get over there or yes, over there.
(Rae laughing)
- And,
really grateful to Chai
for helping me get to that direction.
- [Interviewer] Well guys, this was an amazing conversation.
This is a wrap.
You are all set.
Thank you guys so much.
(Ayumi laughing)
- [Terry] You did good.
- [Ayumi] Huh?
- You did good.
- Oh did I?
- Yeah.
(mellow music)