What did you hear
about how
the former president in his orbit
was reacting to yesterday?
Supposedly,
he wasn't watching much of it,
which I believe Caitlin.
It was a pretty short
hearing from the ones we've seen
But look, he's not happy about i
Most of the people in his orbit
were actually
a little anxious about this
heading into today.
There was some prediction
that there might be
some kind of rally around Trump
which we saw right after the FBI
search at Mar a Lago in August.
I'm not seeing a lot of signs
of that yet.
It's possible it will come.
But, look,
you know, everything with Donald
gets measured by
do I actually get charged?
Is this actually facing criminal
This is unprecedented.
This was a really damning day fo
But does it move him
closer to being indicted?
I don't think we know yet.
What about in the broader scheme
of things?
Because this isn't
the only thing facing him.
Obviously, he's got actual inves
that I'm told his attorneys
are actually much more concerned
But what about the idea
of his political influence,
given these charges are unpreced
with these criminal referrals?
He's got all of these
other investigations
that we've been talking about.
What does that mean for him
and his third run?
Well,
his third run has been we're fiv
in now
it's been pretty lackluster so f
He had minimum seems distracted
or not that interested.
We'll see what it looks like
when we head into a new year.
There's certainly clear signs
that his influence in the party
is waning.
Now, we don't know what that wil
going into next year.
Do other candidates challenge hi
Does Ron DeSantis, who is, you k
the hope
for candidate for a lot of donor
Does he even run?
Or do people
ultimately decide to sit it out?
But there is no question
that Trump is is a more diminish
figure than at any point
that we have seen him since 2015
It seems like
there has been sort of a shift h
Right.
And I'm not sure if it's glacial
but I found it interesting
that you tweeted
that these referrals underscore
the reality that Trump is facing
diminished figure politically,
as you just said there.
You think it's possible that thi
I'm not sure if it's so
that it could provoke a backlash
and even strengthen the former p
That's what happened before.
I'm not sure if that's the same
if that's the case. This time.
That's something that some Repub
who don't like him, to be clear
who I spoke to
yesterday,
who didn't want to say this publ
because they didn't
want to seem like
they were undermining the commit
but they are concerned about tha
because, Don,
we have seen that pattern
so many times
where there is some rallying eff
And I think that's something to
right now.
Again, I'm not seeing signs of t
Now, maybe it will come
but I think that is a clear meas
of whether his influence has wan
just people are just sick of kin
of running to defend him all the
Is it the silence?
The silence is deafening.
I mean, even though he is saying
you know, this is a witch
hunt, it's a sham, it's you know
this is same old talking point.
The silence is kind of deafening
And how he
is diminished,
especially when it comes to the
and his voice.
It's interesting.
It's an interesting turn
because before
he would have been standing
in front of microphones,
everyone would have
been paying attention.
And that does not appear to be h
And his allies
would have been out there saying
you know, this is terrible.
We stand by him.
I don't see much of that.
We'll see what happens next week
I think that there are allies
of his in the House
among Republicans
who are planning on
doing some kind of counter attac
on this report
once the transcripts start comin
And we're expecting
that to start tomorrow.
I expect they will start
looking through those interviews
picking through things
that they can say were inconsist
Things that they can
highlight is, look, you know, th
witness said X, Y, Z,
and this was fair to him.
I think they will try to undermi
Cassidy Hutchinson,
who was the star witness.
So I think we don't know yet
what it's going to look like.
But certainly in the first day a
there is a real fatigue.
All around him.
What about putting in Hope Hicks
that really stood out to you tod
She obviously testified
much later
in the January six investigation
I think it was late October.
Kellyanne Carter
was actually late November.
What did you make of hearing her
talk about her conversations
with Trump, with Eric Hirschman,
Trump attorney?
There's two separate issues.
One is on that, on the matters o
and what was actually discussed.
I've been told by
one person
who is
is aware of both of their testim
that actually their conversation
about whether to get Trump to sa
something was not ahead of Janua
It was actually during the riot
and that Hirschman
was trying
to get Trump to say something
when that was taking place,
that it wasn't before.
In terms of what Hicks
was concerned about,
I've been told that
it was not that she was concerne
that there was going to be
an insurrection at the Capitol
and that she was just concerned
there were going to be protest
and counter-protests.
You know, something more similar
to Charlottesville, Virginia in
But it was still really striking
because there's no one
who is more of a loyalist than h
And hearing her
talk about how he was doing thin
that were undermining
and damaging to himself
and that she clearly didn't
believe what he was saying.
And, you know, to be clear,
she was one of a cast of dozens
at that point who were saying
this is not reality.
But we never hear her speak publ
And it was very striking.
And the same with Kellyanne Conw
We can we do hear speak publicly
but not about stuff like that.
And not at all.
It appears that they were concer
about his legacy
at all leading up to this.
Actually, him saying,
I don't really care about that.
My legacy will be whether and wh
Right.
Because all he sees is
his legacy is being a winner.
He didn't care about anything el
that he had accomplished
during his presidency.