AGAINST THE KURDS.
>> THAT WAS AN INTERESTING
DEVELOPMENT.
THANKS, JENNIFER.
WITH THAT.
>> John: WE BRING IN KURT
VOLKER, THE FORMER U.S. SPECIAL
REPRESENTATIVE FOR UKRAINE.
GREAT TO HAVE YOU WITH US TODAY,
AMBASSADOR.
SO ONE OF THE THINGS THAT
VLADIMIR PUTIN SAID ABOUT THE
POSSIBILITY OF FINLAND AND
SWEDEN JOINING NATO, WHICH IS AN
EARTHQUAKE CHANGE IN EUROPE.
PUTIN SAID PROBLEMS CREATED WITH
NO REASON AT ALL.
WE WILL REACT ACCORDINGLY.
I’M NOT SURE HOW HE THINKS THIS
IS ALL COMING ABOUT OUT OF THIN
AIR GIVEN THE BRUTAL INVASION OF
UKRAINE.
>> THAT’S RIGHT.
THESE COUNTRIES WERE NOT
THINKING ABOUT JOINING NATO AT
THE END OF LAST YEAR.
IT WAS ONLY RUSSIA’S ATTACKS ON
UKRAINE AND THE BRUTALITY OF
THOSE ATTACKS AGAINST CIVILIANS
THAT CAUSED FINLAND AND SWEDEN
TO THINK THE ONLY WAY TO BE SAFE
IS TO BE A MEMBER OF NATO.
RUSSIA HASN’T ATTACKED ANY
MEMBERS OF NATO, AT LEAST NOT
YET BUT THEY HAVE ATTACKED
GEORGIA AND UKRAINE AND OCCUPIES
PART OF MALDOVA.
SO THE LESSON HERE IS IF YOU
WANT TO BE SAFE, YOU SHOULD BE
THINKING ABOUT NATO MEMBERSHIP.
>> Martha: ON THE OTHER HAND,
SEEMS INTERESTING TO WATCH THIS
LARGELY STRENGTHENING NATO
BLOCK, RIGHT?
AT THE SAME TIME THAT IT LOOKS
LIKE PUTIN’S MILITARY IS FALLING
APART FRANKLY.
WHEN YOU LOOK HAT THIS DONETSK
REGION SITUATION, THEY TRIED TO
PUT TWO PONTOONS AND WE HAVE
PHOTOS OF THIS OVER A RIVER TO
FOCUS ON THE EAST BECAUSE THEY
HAVE LOST KYIV AND LOOKS LIKE
THEY LIKE KHARKIV OR THE GROUND
THAT THEY MADE UP THERE.
BLOWN APART TANKS.
THEY LOST 400 RUSSIAN SOLDIERS.
THAT IS ENORMOUS IN THIS ONE
MISSION.
SO WHERE DOES THIS LEAD THEM,
AMBASSADOR?
>> WELL, IT JUST SHOWS THAT THE
RUSSIAN MILITARY IS IN A
DESPERATE STATE.
THEY’RE BEING PUSHED TO KEEP
FIGHTING, SHOW THEY CAN
ACCOMPLISH SOMETHING.
THEY DON’T HAVE THE EQUIPMENT,
THE LEADERSHIP, THE COMMAND AND
CONTROL AND THEY DO SOMETHING
LIKE THIS.
THEY TRY TO COVER THIS RIVER.
THEY MAKE THEMSELVES AN EASY
TARGET AND AN ENTIRE BATTALION
GETS TAKEN OUT, THIS IS A
STUNNING LOSS.
EVEN RUSSIAN BLOGGERS WERE
COMMENTING OVER THE WEEKEND ON
THE ABSOLUTE INCOMPETENCE OF THE
RUSSIA MILITARY HERE.
>> SOME OF THOSE BLOGGERS HAVE
TWO MILLION FOLLOWERS IN RUSSIA.
SO THERE’S NO CURTAIN THAT IS
ALLOWING PUTIN TO SORT OF KEEP
AHOLD ON THIS INFORMATION.
WHERE DO YOU SEE THIS GOING?
WHERE IS THIS IN THREE MONTHS?
>> WELL, IN THREE MONTHS, I
THINK WE’LL BE AT A STAGE WHERE RUSSIA CANNOT HOLDER TERRITORY
RUSSIA CANNOT HOLDER TERRITORY
IN EASTERN YOUR -- UKRAINE.
THE UKRAINIANS HAVE PUSHED THEM
OUT OF KYIV, KHARKIV AND A PUSH
AGAINST KHERSON IN THE SOUTH.
THE RUSSIANS DON’T HAVE THE
ABILITY TO TAKE GROUND.
I THINK THEY’LL FIND IT HARD TO
HOLD THE GROUND THAT THEY HAVE
ALREADY TAKEN.
AS WE HAVE SEEN WITH OTHER
PUSH-BACKS.
WE’LL SEE RUSSIA IN A
SLOW-MOTION DEFEAT HERE.
AT SOME POINT THEY WILL HAVE TO
SEEK TO SETTLE.
WE’RE STARTING TO GET SIGNALS OF THAT EVEN NOW AS THE CHIEF OF
THAT EVEN NOW AS THE CHIEF OF
DEFENSE THERE, THE DEFENSE
MINISTER TOOK THE CALL FROM
CHIEF AUSTIN.
NOW THEY’RE SUGGESTING THERE
SHOULD BE A CEASE FIRE.
I’M SURE THAT IS COMING FROM
RUSSIA, NOT THEM DIRECTLY.
NOW IS THE TIME TO KEEP
SUPPORTING THE UKRAINIANS AND
NOT ACCEPT THAT THERE’S ANY
REWARD FOR THIS RUSSIAN
AGGRESSION AGAINST UKRAINE.
>> Martha: IT SEEMS THE
CONCERTED EFFORT AND ACCELERATED
EFFORTS APPEARS TO BE WEARING
THEM DOWN.
LETS HOPE THAT BRINGS THEM TO
THE TABLE. KURT VOLKER, THANKS VERY MUCH.