THING TO GO TO COMPLETION. >> OKAY, SENATOR KING, THE
INDEPENDENT WHO CAUCUSES WITH
THE DEMOCRATS FROM MAIN.
THANKS FOR COMING ON AND SHARING
YOUR VIEWS.
YOUR VIEWS. APPRECIATE IT.
APPRECIATE IT. >>> JOINING ME FROM ACROSS THE
AISLE IS SENATOR RAND PAUL OF
KENTUCKY.
KENTUCKY. SENATOR PAUL, WELCOME BACK TO
"MEET THE PRESS," SIR.
>> GOOD MORNING, CHUCK.
THANKS FOR HAVING ME.
>> LET ME START WHERE I LEFT OFF
WITH SENATOR KING.
BASED ON THESE FEDERAL DOCUMENTS
THAT YOU’VE SEEN FROM MICHAEL
COHEN AT THIS POINT, IF HE
WASN’T PRESIDENT, DO YOU THINK
INDIVIDUAL 1 WOULD HAVE ALSO
BEEN INDICTED ALONG WITH MICHAEL
COHEN?
COHEN? >> YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT’S
INTERESTING ABOUT THIS IS PEOPLE
FORGET HISTORY.
FORGET HISTORY. THE FEDERAL ELECTIONS COMMISSION
ACTUALLY RULED ON THIS WITH JOHN
EDWARDS.
EDWARDS. THEY ACTUALLY CAME UP WITH A
RULING AND SAID THAT, YOU KNOW
WHAT, THE PAYING OF HIS MISTRESS
WAS NOT A CAMPAIGN FINANCE
VIOLATION.
VIOLATION. BUT I THINK IT’S BIGGER THAN
THIS.
THIS. AND I THINK WE HAVE TO DECIDE IN
OUR SOCIETY IF -- THERE ARE
THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS OF
RULES, IT’S INCREDIBLY
COMPLICATED CAMPAIGN FINANCE.
WE HAVE TO DECIDE WHETHER OR NOT
CRIMINAL PENALTIES ARE THE WAY
WE SHOULD APPROACH CRIMINAL
FINANCE.
FINANCE. I PERSONALLY THINK IF SOMEONE
MAKES AN ERROR IN FILING
PAPERWORK OR NOT CATEGORIZING A
CAMPAIGN CONTRIBUTION CORRECTLY,
IT SHOULDN’T BE JAIL TIME, IT
OUGHT TO BE A FINE.
IT’S JUST LIKE A LOT OF OTHER
THINGS WE’VE DONE IN WASHINGTON,
WE’VE OVERCRIMINALIZED CAMPAIGN
FINANCE.
FINANCE. >> LET ME ASK YOU ABOUT THE
ALLEGATION THAT MICHAEL COHEN
HAD CIRCULATED HIS FALSE
TESTIMONY TO CONGRESS IN ADVANCE
SO PEOPLE IN AND AROUND THE
PRESIDENT, PERHAPS HIS LAWYERS,
PERHAPS HIM, KNEW IN ADVANCE
THAT MICHAEL COHEN WAS GOING TO
LIE TO CONGRESS.
>> ABOUT WHAT ISSUE?
>> ABOUT THE ISSUE OF THE TRUMP
TOWER MOSCOW PROJECT.
>> I DON’T -- I GUESS I DON’T --
>> HOW DOES THAT SIT WITH YOU?
>> I GUESS I DON’T QUITE
UNDERSTAND IT BECAUSE I DON’T
KNOW WHAT’S ILLEGAL ABOUT TRYING
TO BUILD A HOTEL IN RUSSIA.
SO THIS IS PRETTY COMMON, AND I
SEE NO PROBLEM WITH SOMEONE
RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT TRYING TO
BUILD A HOTEL SOMEWHERE.
NOW, IF YOU ARE ASKING AND
SAYING I WILL GIVE YOU SOMETHING
IN EXCHANGE FOR LETTING US BUILD
A HOTEL, THAT WOULD BE WRONG.
BUT I HAVEN’T HEARD ANY EVIDENCE
OF THAT.
OF THAT. JUST TRYING TO BUILD A HOTEL
SOMEWHERE, I CAN’T IMAGINE HOW
THAT WOULD BE CRIMINAL.
>> BUT --
>> BUT -- >> OR WHY YOU’D LIE ABOUT IT IF
IT’S NOT CRIMINAL.
>> THAT’S WHAT I’M CURIOUS
ABOUT.
ABOUT. WHY DO YOU THINK THE STORY KEEPS
CHANGING IN AND AROUND THE
PRESIDENT IF ALL THESE THINGS
ARE AS INNOCENT AS YOU’VE SAID.
>> RIGHT.
>> RIGHT. >> WHY DOES HE KEEP CHANGING HIS
STORY?
STORY? >> I THINK IT GOES BACK TO THIS
WHOLE IDEA OF PROSECUTORIAL
ABUSE.
ABUSE. COHEN IS FACING -- THEY’RE
SAYING HE’S GETTING THIS LONG
SENTENCE OF FOUR YEARS.
OH, MY GOODNESS, HE’S GETTING A
REALLY, REALLY SHORT SENTENCE.
THEY’RE THREATENING HIM WITH 20
YEARS OR LIFE IN PRISON FOR TAX
EVASION AND SHORTENING TO FOUR
YEARS.
YEARS. THEY KEEP GETTING THE STORY TO
CHANGE BUT MAYBE THAT’S BECAUSE
THE PROSECUTORS PRESSURE HIM SAY
IF YOU DON’T GIVE HIM SOMETHING
ON TRUMP, YOU GET 20 YEARS.
IF YOU GIVE US SOMETHING ON
TRUMP, YOU GET FOUR YEARS.
SO THIS IS PROSECUTORIAL ABUSE,
I THINK, AND THAT’S WHY HIS
STORY KEEPS SHIFTING.
IT MAKES NO SENSE.
THE PRESIDENT WAS TALKING TO THE
MEDIA OPENLY ABOUT THE DEAL IN
RUSSIA IN 2015.
WHY WOULD IT MAKE A DIFFERENCE
WHETHER HE STILL WAS TALKING TO
PEOPLE IN 2016 VERSUS 2015.
SO REALLY I THINK WE’RE TRYING
TO MAKE AND FIND A CRIME.
THIS HAS BEEN MY OVERALL
COMPLAINT ABOUT HAVING THESE
SPECIAL PROSECUTORS IS THAT
REALLY THEY FIND A PERSON AND
THEY LOOK FOR A CRIME.
TRADITIONAL JUSTICE IN OUR
COUNTRY IS SOMEONE STEALS
SOMETHING FROM THE GROCERY STORE
AND YOU HAVE A CRIME, YOU TRY TO
FIND OUT WHO DID IT.
WITH THE SPECIAL PROSECUTOR YOU
DECIDE WE’RE GOING AFTER
SOMEONE, THE PRESIDENT, AND
WE’RE GOING TO SQUEEZE AS MANY
PEOPLE AS WE CAN UNTIL WE CAN
TRY TO GET A PERSON.
AND THAT’S WHY I’M AGAINST THESE
SPECIAL PROSECUTORS.
SPECIAL PROSECUTORS. I THINK THEY’RE A HUGE MISTAKE
AND I THINK THEY’RE A HUGE ABUSE
OF GOVERNMENT POWER.
>> THE REASON HE WAS APPOINTED
WAS TO INVESTIGATE RUSSIAN
INTERFERENCE, IT WASN’T TO
INVESTIGATE THE PRESIDENT.
>> WELL, BUT THEN WHY IS HE
INVESTIGATING TAX EVASION AND
WHETHER OR NOT YOU FILED AS A
FEDERAL LOBBYIST?
FEDERAL LOBBYIST? ALL THE STUFF THAT’S BEEN DONE
TO EITHER MANAFORT OR FLYNN OR
ANY OF THE OTHERS REALLY SEEMS
TO BE ABOUT OTHER SUBJECTS AND
REALLY WHAT THEY DID TO FLYNN, I
THINK, WAS UNCONSCIONABLE AND
I’M HOPING THAT MEANS MUELLER
HAS A CONSCIOUS.
MAYBE IT’S NOT THAT FLYNN GAVE
SO MUCH INFORMATION.
MAYBE MUELLER HAS A CONSCIENCE
AND KNOWS HOW UNFAIR IT IS WHAT
THEY DID TO FLYNN.
HE WAS NEVER DISCUSSING ANYTHING
ILLEGAL BUT IT GETS TIED UP IN
TALKING TO THE FBI WHETHER HE
WAS EXPLICIT, EVEN THOUGH THE
ORIGINAL FBI AGENT SAID THEY DID
NOT THINK HE WAS BEING
DUPLICITOUS, THEY DID NOT THINK
HE WAS LYING.
SO IT’S VERY TROUBLING WHAT
THESE SPECIAL PROSECUTORS CAN
DO.
DO. I TELL PEOPLE THIS.
IF A SPECIAL PROSECUTOR WENT
AFTER YOUR LIFE FOR THE LAST 40
YEARS, NOT YOU IN PARTICULAR BUT
ANYBODY, I THINK THEY COULD
DREDGE UP ACCUSATIONS.
SO I’M ABSOLUTELY AGAINST IT AND
I THINK IT’S A MISCARRIAGE OF
JUSTICE AND WE SHOULD NOT HAVE
SPECIAL PROSECUTORS GOING AFTER
ONE PERSON.
ONE PERSON. AND IF WE GET THIS WAY AND IF
WE’RE GOING TO PROSECUTE PEOPLE
AND PUT THEM IN JAIL FOR
CAMPAIGN FINANCE VIOLATIONS,
WE’VE BECOME A BANANA REPUBLIC
WHERE EVERY PRESIDENT GETS
PROSECUTED AND EVERYBODY GETS
THROWN IN JAIL WHEN THEY’RE DONE
WITH OFFICE.
WITH OFFICE. >> LET ME ASK YOU THIS.
YOU’RE A STRICT
CONSTITUTIONALIST.
CONSTITUTIONALIST. I THINK YOU WOULD PROBABLY TAKE
THAT AS A COMPLIMENT WHEN IT
COMES TO YOUR --
>> ABSOLUTELY.
>> ABSOLUTELY. >> -- PURIFIED READING.
DOES THAT MEAN THIS BELONGS IN
CONGRESS’ HANDS AND IT’S UP TO
CONGRESS TO INVESTIGATE THESE
CRIMES AND NOT A SPECIAL
PROSECUTOR?
PROSECUTOR? >> YES.
>> YES. AND THE OTHER THING IS CRIMES
CAN BE INVESTIGATED AS WELL.
IF THERE ARE CRIMES THAT ARE
BEING COMMITTED.
BEING COMMITTED. BUT WITHOUT A SPECIAL
PROSECUTOR, WHAT HAPPENS IS YOU
INVESTIGATE CRIMES.
INVESTIGATE CRIMES. YOU DON’T GO TO THIS WHOLE IDEA
OF SORT OF CONSPIRACY.
HERE’S THE DANGER OF CONSPIRACY
AND WE’RE DISCUSSING THIS RIGHT
NOW WITH REFORMING OUR DRUG
LAWS.
LAWS. WHAT THEY DO IS, YOU KNOW, AN
UNFORTUNATE YOUNG WOMAN IS
TRANSFERRING MONEY FROM HER
BOYFRIEND, WHO’S A DRUG DEALER,
GETS CAUGHT UP.
THEY ADD CONSPIRACY TO IT AND
TED
TED ADD 10 OR 15 OR 20 YEARS AND NOW
THIS WOMAN IS IN LIFE FOR
EXCHANGING SOME MONEY WITH A
DRUG DEALER.
DRUG DEALER. SO WE HAVE TO BE WARY OF WHAT WE
DO WITH CONSPIRACY BECAUSE IT
ADDS A LOT OF YEARS TO SENTENCES
AND WE COMPOUND THESE SENTENCES.
WE HAVE NONVIOLENT PEOPLE IN
PRISON.
PRISON. THERE WAS A GUY THAT SOLD
MARIJUANA AND GOT CAUGHT FOR HIS
THIRD TIME AND GOT 55 YEARS IN
PRISON.
PRISON. THAT’S NOT RIGHT.
>> I WANT TO GO TO SAUDI ARABIA.
YOU’VE BEEN ONE OF THE ADVOCATES
OF GETTING AMERICA OUT OF THE
WAR IN YEMEN.
I WANT TO PLAY FOR YOU THE
PRESIDENT’S FRIENDLINESS TO
SAUDI ARABIA.
SAUDI ARABIA. I’M CURIOUS IF THIS BOTHERS YOU.
TAKE A LISTEN.
>> I LIKE THE SAUDIS, THEY’RE
VERY NICE.
VERY NICE. THEY BUY MY APARTMENTS, YOU
WOULDN’T BELIEVE IT.
I MAKE A LOT OF MONEY WITH THEM.
THEY BUY ALL SORTS OF MY STUFF.
ALL KINDS OF TOYS FROM TRUMP.
THEY’LL PAY ME ANYTHING.
THEY HAVE NOTHING BUT MONEY.
>> ARE YOU AT ALL CONCERNED THAT
THE PRESIDENT’S POSITIONS IN
SAUDI ARABIA HAVE -- ARE
IMPACTED BY HIS OWN FINANCIAL
DEALINGS WITH THEM?
>> I THINK THAT WHEN WE’RE
DEALING WITH ARMS, THAT NO
PERSONAL FINANCIAL DEALINGS
SHOULD HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH
THE DECISION.
THE DECISION. REALLY NOT EVEN THE FINANCES OF
THE COUNTRY.
THE COUNTRY. I THINK SELLING ARMS SHOULD HAVE
TO DEAL SOLELY WITH OUR NATIONAL
SECURITY, NOT JOBS, NOT MONEY,
NOTHING.
NOTHING. AND I REALLY THINK THAT THE WAR
IN YEMEN THAT WE HAVE NO VITAL
NATIONAL SECURITY INTEREST, AND
NOT ONLY THAT, I THINK OUR
INVOLVEMENT IN THIS TERRIBLE WAR
IS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT
ENGENDERS MORE TERRORISM.
AS MORE PEOPLE DIE FROM
STARVATION, AS PEOPLE PICK UP
BOMB FRAGMENTS AND ON THE BOMB
FRAGMENT IT SAYS MADE IN
AMERICA, IT CREATES MORE
TERRORISM.
TERRORISM. SO I THINK IT’S A RISK TO BE
INVOLVED WITH THE SAUDIS AND WE
SHOULD NOT BE AIDING AND
ABETTING THEIR BOMBING OF
CIVILIAN AREAS.
CIVILIAN AREAS. YEMEN IS ONE OF THE POOREST
COUNTRIES ON THE PLANET.
80% OF THE FOOD COMES THROUGH A
PORT.
PORT. POMPEO TOLD THEM THREE WEEKS AGO
QUIT BOMBING CIVILIAN PORTS.
WHAT HAVE HAD SAUDIS DONE?
THEY HAVE DROPPED 300 MORE BOMBS
ON CIVILIAN AREAS SINCE THEN.
THE SAUDIS ARE NOT GOOD ACTORS
AND WILL NOT RESPOND UNLESS WE
QUIT SELLING THEM ARMS.
I WOULD ALSO EXPEL THE SAUDI
AMBASSADOR.
AMBASSADOR. THE SAUDI AMBASSADOR SHOULD GO
HOME.
HOME. THAT WOULD SEND A STRONG MESSAGE
THAT WE’RE DISPLEASED WITH WHAT
THEY’RE DOING.
THEY’RE DOING. >> AND FINALLY ON THE
PRESIDENT’S NOMINATION OF
WILLIAM BARR.
WILLIAM BARR. IT’S BEEN NOTED THAT HE HAS AN
EXPANSIVE VIEW OF EXECUTIVE
POWER.
POWER. WHEN I HEARD THAT, I THOUGHT,
UH-OH, HE MAY HAVE TROUBLE
GETTING RAND PAUL’S VOTE FOR
CONFIRMATION.
CONFIRMATION. AM I CORRECT?
>> UH-OH IS RIGHT.
I’M CONCERNED THAT HE’S BEEN A
BIG SUPPORTER OF THE PATRIOT ACT
WHICH LOWERED THE STANDARD FOR
SPYING ON AMERICANS AND EVEN
WENT SO FAR TO SAY THAT THE
PATRIOT ACT IS PRETTY GOOD BUT
WE SHOULD GO FURTHER.
I’M DISTURBED THAT HE’S A FAN OF
TAKING PEOPLE’S PROPERTY WITHOUT
A CONVICTION.
A CONVICTION. MANY POOR PEOPLE IN OUR COUNTRY
HAVE CASH TAKEN FROM THEM AND
THE GOVERNMENT SAYS PROVE TO US
WHERE YOU GOT THE CASH AND YOU
CAN GET IT BACK, BUT THE BURDEN
IS ON THE INDIVIDUAL.
IT’S CALLED CIVIL ASSET
FORFEITURE AND HE’S A BIG FAN OF
THAT.
THAT. I HAVEN’T MADE A DECISION YET ON
HIM.
HIM. BUT THE FIRST THINGS I’VE
LEARNED ABOUT HIM BEING FOR MORE
SURVEILLANCE OF AMERICANS IS