In the wake of George Floyd's horrific death,
protests across the country spread,
and the response by police seemed to only further tensions
between black Americans and law enforcement.
But in Michigan, one sheriff stood out.
He removed his helmet and stood with the people.
Sheriff Chris Swanson joins us now from Michigan.
We're also joined by my good friend,
Congresswoman Karen Bass, who is calling for
police departments to be held accountable.
Let me begin with you, Congresswoman Bass.
How do you feel about what's happening in America
after this tragic loss of George Floyd?
We're really at a moral moment in our country,
and so at some point we have to say
why do these things keep happening?
What type of policy needs to change?
On the one hand, I have been inspired
to see the absolute rainbow.
In some cities, you actually see
very few African-Americans protesting.
Most of the protestors are white,
and I think that that is wonderful.
On the other hand, the tragedy of the violence
and the looting, and in my opinion,
there's like an opportunist element,
a political opportunist and a criminal opportunist element
that takes the focus away from the policy changes
that need to take place so that
this doesn't keep occurring.
I couldn't agree with you more,
and it comes from the heart.
The change has to come from the heart,
and there has to be accountability,
and Sheriff Swanson, why don't you think more police
haven't done what you have done?
Well, I can tell you that
sometimes police see dropping your swords
and being vulnerable as a sign of weakness,
and it is the farthest thing from weakness.
Mr. Floyd changed American policing
because now we see that by responding in a way
of just listening and deescalating,
you can make history, and that's what happened
in Flint, Michigan.
Well, I couldn't agree more,
and you know, one of the things that I have to say,
sitting here as a white male in America,
is I learned many years ago,
I have to acknowledge, as a white male,
that white privilege is a real thing.
It really exists, and I have to acknowledge that.
I can walk in a store, and not be followed.
I can drive a nice car through any neighborhood,
and not be stopped because I'm driving a nice car.
I can be pulled over by the police
and not fear that this is the most dangerous
five minutes of my life. Yes.
And if I'm not willing to acknowledge that,
then there's no way I can become a catalyst for change,
and I want to use my platform to give a voice,
and Representative Bass, we have to,
in the white community, we have to walk
with all people of color to precipitate this change
and make it at a policy level.
How do we do it on the Hill?
How do we do it as former President Obama just wrote about
a few days ago, at the local level as well?
How do we precipitate that change?
I do have to tell you that you just don't know
how meaningful it is to hear your words
about recognizing the difference,
and then for the sheriff,
that is just, I mean, it's quite emotional,
the idea that he would do what he did
because part of it has to be a cultural change
within the police department,
so when it comes to inner city communities,
the police come in with a warrior mentality.
When it comes to affluent communities,
and in my district, I represent very affluent communities,
and I represent the inner city,
and policing is completely different
on both sides of my district.
Legislatively, the police, especially police unions
have been very powerful over the years,
passing legislation that makes it virtually impossible
to hold them accountable,
and so those are some of the policy issues
that we are gonna roll out in the next week congressionally,
and then with my colleagues, elected officials
who are afraid to take a vote
that is gonna make them look weak
on quote, unquote, "crime,"
and so we're gonna have to really push on the Hill
with Democrats and with Republicans to say
this is a moral moment, and we need to take a stand.
This really makes us look bad around,
you have protests all around the world
against what is happening in the United States
and as we fight for human rights on the international stage,
we absolutely have to fight for human rights at home.
And protest is right.
Protest is a righteous thing to do,
and we fought to have that right in America.
There's no question that we have to
use that energy to bring about change.