>>> DID YOU EVER INVESTIGATE A MOB ORGANIZATION WHERE UNCLE SAL
AND EVERYBODY TOLD THE SAME LIE
BUT THE PERSON AT THE TOP DIDN’T
KNOW ABOUT IT?
>> NO.
>> NO. THIS IS CLASSIC KIND OF CRIMINAL
ENTERPRISE BEHAVIOR.
ENTERPRISE BEHAVIOR. YOU HAVE A STRONG LEADER WHO
RULES BY FORCE OF WILL AND
PERSONALITY, WHO DEMANDS
UNQUESTIONED LOYALTY FROM THOSE
PEOPLE AROUND HIM.
THAT IS AN ACT OF
SELF-PRESERVATION.
SELF-PRESERVATION. THAT LEADER KNOWS HE’S GOT TO
HAVE THAT LOYALTY, HE’S GOT TO
BE SURE THAT PEOPLE ARE ON HIS
SIDE, IF YOU’RE NOT ON HIS SIDE
YOU’RE AGAINST HIM.
AND IF YOU DON’T HAVE THAT IT’S
A THREAT TO HIS VERY EXISTENCE,
HIS OR HER VERY EXISTENCE.
THOSE ARE SOME OF THE SAME
TRAITS THAT I SAW INTERACTING
WITH THE PRESIDENT AND THE FOLKS
IN HIS ADMINISTRATION.
SOME OF THEM.
>> UNMENTIONED THING HE’S
TALKING ABOUT THERE, THAT WOULD
ALSO BE THE ARCHITECTURE OF A
POTENTIAL RICO CHARGE, AS HAS
BEEN MENTIONED.
BEEN MENTIONED. MORE THERE FROM THE FORMER FBI
ACTING DIRECTOR, ANDREW McCABE,
WITH NICOLLE WALLACE DURING THAT
INTERVIEW 4:00 P.M. EASTERN TIME
HERE IN THE STUDIO TODAY.
McCABE’S BOOK, AGAIN, HAS BEEN
OUT FOR TWO DAYS.
HIS BOOK TOUR JUST STARTED ON
SUNDAY NIGHT.
SUNDAY NIGHT. AND HIS COMMENTS ARE GENERATING
SO MANY HEADLINES.
EARLIER TONIGHT McCABE TOLD
CHRIS HAYES IT’S POSSIBLE DONALD
TRUMP HAS BEEN COMPROMISED BY
RUSSIA.
RUSSIA. HOURS EARLIER THE FORMER
ASSISTANT DIRECTOR FOR
COUNTERINTELLIGENCE AT THE FBI,
FRANK FIGURE LUZZI, SAID McCABE
WAS PLAYING CHESS AT THE HIGHEST
LEVEL DURING HIS TIME ON THE
INSIDE WITH HIS HANDLING OF THE
RUSSIA INVESTIGATION.
RUSSIA INVESTIGATION. >> BETWEEN YOUR CONVERSATION
WITH ANDY AND OURS IN THE GREEN
ROOM WITH ANDY WE’VE LEARNED
SOMETHING.
SOMETHING. WE’VE LEARNED --
>> I LOVE IT WHEN THAT HAPPENS.
>> YEAH.
>> YEAH. HE DIDN’T OPEN A SEPARATE CASE
ON THE PRESIDENT.
HE ADDED THE PRESIDENT TO THE
ALREADY PREDICATED, ALREADY
LONG-EXISTING CASE ON RUSSIA
MEDDLING WITH THE CAMPAIGN.
WHY IS THAT IMPORTANT?
THAT CASE WAS A FULL
COUNTERINTELLIGENCE
COUNTERINTELLIGENCE INVESTIGATION.
INVESTIGATION. WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?
YOU HAVE SPECIFIC AND
ARTICULABLE FACTS THAT SOMEONE
IS OR MAY BE AN AGENT OF A
FOREIGN POWER.
FOREIGN POWER. HE FELT HE HAD ENOUGH TO ADD
TRUMP’S NAME TO THAT EXISTING
CASE.
CASE. THAT’S BIG NEWS.
>> THAT WAS A GENUINE MOMENT ON
THAT SHOW THIS AFTERNOON.
AND BACK WITH US ON THE
BROADCAST TONIGHT WE’RE PLEASED
TO HAVE FORMER CIA DIRECTOR JOHN
BRENNAN.
BRENNAN. ALSO HAPPENS TO BE OUR SENIOR
NATIONAL SECURITY AND
INTELLIGENCE ANALYST.
INTELLIGENCE ANALYST. DIRECTOR BRENNAN, MR. McCABE IS
OUT THERE TALKING ABOUT OUR
PRESIDENT AS A POSSIBLE RUSSIAN
ASSET
ASSET ASSET.
ASSET. SOME PEOPLE WATCHING NO DOUBT
HEAR THIS AND CHALK IT UP TO
CRAZY TALK AND PERHAPS THEY HAVE
HEARD THE ATTACKS ON MR. McCABE
FROM THE CONSERVATIVE MEDIA,
FROM THE PRESIDENT.
I WANTED TO GET YOUR TAKE ON THE
POSSIBILITY THAT OUR PRESIDENT
IS A RUSSIAN ASSET.
>> WELL, I WORKED CLOSELY WITH
ANDY McCABE FOR SEVERAL YEARS,
AND HE ALWAYS IMPRESSED ME AS A
VERY SERIOUS, HARD-WORKING, AND
COMPETENT SENIOR OFFICIAL OF THE
FBI.
FBI. AND I DO THINK HE HANDLED THE
INVESTIGATION VERY ADEPTLY AND
CAREFULLY.
CAREFULLY. AND IF HE DECIDED AT THAT POINT,
OF THE ONGOING INVESTIGATION,
THAT HE NEEDED TO INCLUDE DONALD
TRUMP AS A POTENTIAL TARGET FOR
THE COUNTERINTELLIGENCE
THE COUNTERINTELLIGENCE INVESTIGATION, I DO BELIEVE
THERE WAS A SUFFICIENT BASIS,
AGAIN, BASED ON MY KNOWLEDGE OF
ANDY McCABE HE WOULDN’T DO
SOMETHING LIKE THAT WITHOUT A
SUFFICIENT PREDICATE.
SUFFICIENT PREDICATE. YOU NO, I DON’T KNOW WHAT HAS
HAPPENED IN THAT INVESTIGATION
SINCE I LEFT GOVERNMENT IN
JANUARY OF 2017.
BUT I KNOW THAT THERE WAS A LOT
OF INFORMATION THAT WAS
AVAILABLE WHEN I WAS THERE ABOUT
RUSSIAN ENGAGEMENT IN THE
INTERFERENCE IN THE 2016
ELECTION AND ALSO A LOT OF
QUESTIONS ABOUT MR. TRUMP’S
ACTIONS, HIS STATEMENTS, AND HIS
BEHAVIOR AND THOSE AROUND HIM SO
I DO HOPE THAT BOB MUELLER IS
GOING TO BRING THIS TO
CONCLUSION AND LET US KNOW
EXACTLY WHAT THE EVIDENCE HAS
BEEN ABLE TO UNCOVER ABOUT
RUSSIAN ENGAGEMENT AS WELL AS
THE ROLE OF U.S. PERSONS IN THIS
INTRIGUE.
INTRIGUE. >> SO ANDY McCABE IN REAL TIME
ON THE AIR AND IN THE GREEN ROOM
IN THIS BUILDING TODAY KIND OF
ADDED TO WHAT WE KNOW.
HE SAID PUBLICLY AND TO FRANK
FIGLIUZZI THAT HE IN FACT ADDED
DONALD TRUMP TO AN ALREADY OPEN
AND BULGING FILE OF A
COUNTERINTELLIGENCE
COUNTERINTELLIGENCE INVESTIGATION BASED ON THINGS
THAT DURING THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN
LOOKED HINKY TO INVESTIGATORS
AND NOT THOROUGHLY AMERICAN WITH
THIS MANY RUSSIANS CRAWLING
AROUND.
AROUND. SO A TECHNICAL QUESTION TO YOU.
WHEN DONALD TRUMP GETS ADDED TO
THAT INVESTIGATION, AND THAT
MEANS EVERYONE IN HIS ORBIT, I
KNOW YOU’RE NOT GOING TO GIVE UP
SOURCES AND METHODS.
HOW MUCH OF SOMEONE’S LIFE CAN
YOU THEN READ THROUGH AND LISTEN
TO IF THEY ARE WORTH
INVESTIGATING?
INVESTIGATING? >> WELL, COUNTERINTELLIGENCE
INVESTIGATIONS ARE DONE VERY
CAREFULLY AND THOROUGHLY.
AND YOU WANT TO MAKE SURE YOU
HAVE ACCESS TO WHATEVER
INFORMATION MIGHT GIVE YOU SOME
INSIGHTS INTO WHAT MIGHT BE
GOING ON.
GOING ON. SO FROM THE STOOPTANDPOINT OF
FINANCIAL RECORDS, PAST
ACTIVITIES, WHETHER IT BE IN
BUSINESS OR GOVERNMENT, THE
INDIVIDUALS THAT YOU INTERACT
WITH.
WITH. AND I DON’T KNOW WHAT WAS
INITIATED THEN AT THAT POINT IN
TERMS OF ANY TYPE OF COLLECTION
OF PAST INFORMATION AS WELL AS
ONGOING INFORMATION.
ONGOING INFORMATION. SO IT’S UP TO THE FBI OFFICIALS
THAT WOULD BE RESPONSIBLE FOR
THE CASE TO DECIDE HOW EXTENSIVE
AND HOW DEEP THAT INVESTIGATION
SHOULD GO.
SHOULD GO. >> I WANT TO PLAY YOU A CLIP
FROM MR. McCABE.
AT THE END OF THIS HE POSES A
QUESTION WHICH WE’LL THEN POSE
TO YOU.
TO YOU. >> JUST ASK YOURSELF HAVE WE
EVER HAD AN ADMINISTRATION THAT
HAD THIS VOLUME OF CONNECTIONS
WITH OUR MOST CONSIDERABLE, MOST
FORMIDABLE ADVERSARY, AND GONE
TO SUCH XENTS TO COVER THOSE
CONNECTIONS UP?
CONNECTIONS UP? THESE ARE THINGS THAT PROMPT
QUESTIONS IN INVESTIGATORS’
MINDS.
MINDS. WE GET BACK TO THAT WHY, WHY IS
THIS.
THIS. WHY WOULD THE PRESIDENT
POTENTIALLY TRY TO OBSTRUCT
JUSTICE AND NEGATIVELY IMPACT
OUR INVESTIGATION INTO RUSSIA?
WHY ARE HIS ASSOCIATES AND THE
PEOPLE AROUND HIM AND PEOPLE IN
HIS KEY POSITIONS LYING ABOUT
THEIR CONTACTS WITH RUSSIANS?
THESE ARE VERY CONCERNING
QUESTIONS AND THINGS THAT NEED
TO BE INVESTIGATED.
>> DIRECTOR BRENNAN, YOU WANT TO
TAKE A WHACK AT ANY OF THAT?
>> WELL, I DON’T DISAGREE WITH
ANYTHING ANDY SAID.
THIS IS A VERY ABNORMAL
SITUATION WHERE YOU HAVE DONALD
TRUMP AS WELL AS THOSE AROUND
HIM WHO CONTINUE TO DO THINGS
THAT RAISE EYEBROWS AMONG
COUNTERINTELLIGENCE
COUNTERINTELLIGENCE PROFESSIONALS IN TERMS OF HOW HE
HAS INTERACTED WITH MR. PUTIN,
THE TYPES OF THINGS HE AND
OTHERS HAVE TRIED TO CONCEAL,
WHAT ARE THEY HIDING.
THESE ARE THE THINGS THAT RAISED
VERY APPROPRIATE SUSPICIONS AND
CONCERNS.
CONCERNS. THE RUSSIANS ARE VERY, VERY
CAPABLE WHEN IT COMES TO
CULTIVATING RELATIONSHIPS AND
GETTING PEOPLE TO COOPERATE WITH
THEM.
THEM. AND AGAIN, SOMETIMES IT’S DONE
IN AN UNWITTING FASHION, BUT
SOMETIMES THEY GET INDIVIDUALS
INTO COMPROMISING SITUATIONS
WHERE THEY THEN CAN INTIMIDATE
THE INDIVIDUAL IN MANY RESPECTS
TO HELP THEM RATHER THAN HAVE
SOMETHING BE EXPOSED PUBLICLY.
I THINK THAT’S WHAT ANDY WAS
ALLUDING TO THERE.
THERE IS JUST A LOT THAT WE
DON’T KNOW IN TERMS OF WHAT THE
RUSSIANS WERE ABLE TO DO AND
WHAT THEY’VE BEEN ABLE TO DO ARE
U.S. PERSONS.
U.S. PERSONS. >> FINAL QUESTION.
AT THIS CRITICAL TIME IN THIS
ADMINISTRATION AND FOR OUR
COUNTRY HOW ALARMED SHOULD
AMERICANS BE IF WE WAKE UP ONE
OF THESE MORNINGS AND TRUMP HAS
FIRED DAN COATS, THE DIRECTOR OF
NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE?
NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE? >> WELL, I THINK WE SHOULD BE
VERY CONCERNED JUST LIKE WE WERE
VERY CONCERNED WHEN HE FIRED JIM
COMEY.
COMEY. AND CLEARLY TO TRY TO PUT AN END
TO THE RUSSIA INVESTIGATION.
I WORKED CLOSELY WITH DAN COATS
WHEN HE WAS A MEMBER OF THE
SENATE INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE.
HE IS AN INDIVIDUAL OF INTEGRITY
AS WELL AS OF PRINCIPLES AND
ETHICS.
ETHICS. AND THAT IS WHY MR. TRUMP
APPARENTLY DOES NOT LIKE HIM,
BECAUSE HE IS NOT GOING TO GIVE
MR. TRUMP THE LOYALTY THAT MR.
TRUMP EXPECTS.
TRUMP EXPECTS. SO I DO THINK WE SEE THIS
UNRAVELING OF MR. TRUMP IN TERMS
OF WHAT HE IS DOING, TRYING TO
TAKE WHATEVER STEP HE CAN TO
PREVENT THE TRUTH FROM COMING
OUT, WHETHER IT BE ABOUT THIS
INVESTIGATION OR WHETHER IT BE
ABOUT NORTH KOREA, IRAN, RUSSIA,
AND OTHER MATTERS.
THIS IS SOMETHING I THINK WE ALL
SHOULD BE CONCERNED ABOUT.
THIS IS A VERY ABNORMAL
SITUATION WITH A VERY ABNORMAL