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PETE: WELL, A HISTORIC MOVE IN
IRELAND AS THE COUNTRY VOTED TO
REPEAL A LAW BANNING ABORTION.
SOME IN THE U.S. MEDIA MARKING
THIS AS A VICTORY.
LISTEN.
>> IN IRELAND, A ALLOW AND
EMPHATIC "YES" AS VOTERS REPEAL
A CONSTITUTIONAL BAN ON ABORTION
A CONSTITUTIONAL BAN ON
ABORTION.
>> THE FINAL TALLY SHOWING
OVERWHELMING SUPPORT FOR WOMEN'S
REPRODUCTIVE RIGHTS IN THE
MOSTLY CATHOLIC COUNTRY.
>> THIS VOTE MARKS A DRAMATIC
SHIFT IN WHAT WAS ONCE DESCRIBED
AS THE MOST CATHOLIC COUNTRY IN
THE WORLD.
PETE: SO, DOES THIS MOVE MOVE
THE CATHOLIC FAITH MORE TO THE
LEFT AS RELIGION BECOMES MORE
PROGRESSIVE TO WELCOME MORE
PEOPLE IN?
IS THAT A GOOD THING OR SHOULD
WE STICK TO THE ORIGINAL TENETS?
THAT IS THE CORE QUESTION HERE,
SHOULD RELIGION STAY
CONSERVATIVE TO THE CORE TENETS
OR FOLLOW THE PROGRESSIVE TRENDS
OR FOLLOW THE PROGRESSIVE
TRENDS-of-SOCIETY?
LET'S BRING IN OUR RELIGIOUS
PANEL TO DISCUSS.
DR. MENEZAFRIDI IS A MUSLIM
SCHOLARLY, DR. RAZZ IS THE
NATIONAL LEADERSHIP CONFERENCE,
RABBI COOPER IS AN ASSOCIATE
DEAN IS HE SIMON WIESENTHAL
CENTER, AND FATHER JONATHAN
MORRIS IS A FOX NEWS RELIGION
CONTRIBUTOR.
A GREAT PANEL. I COULD START IT
OUT THIS WAY.
A MUSLIM SCHOLAR, EVANGELICAL
PASTOR, AND CATHOLIC PIECE ENTER
A JAR.
BUT I WON'T.
IT WOULD BE THE START OF A GREAT
JOKE.
NO LAUGHING MATTER, A SERIOUS
SUBJECT.
FATHER JOHN, I WANT TO START
WITH YOU.
IRELAND, A PREDOMINANTLY
CATHOLIC COUNTRY, WHAT IS THIS
VOTE SAYING ABOUT THE CURRENT
STATUS OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH?
>> WE SHOULD BE CLEAR THAT THE
LEADERSHIP OF THE CACHE STOOD UP
AGAINST THE REPEAL OF THIS
AMENDMENT, SO IT WASN'T THAT THE
CATHOLIC CHURCH HAS SAID NO,
THIS IS THE DIRECTION WE WANT TO
GO IN.
BUT THEY DID NOT HAVE THE
AUTHORITY OR THE PERSUASIVENESS
SUFFICIENT IN ORDER TO SAY "NO"
TO THIS REPEAL OF THIS AMENDMENT
TO THIS REPEAL OF THIS
AMENDMENT.
AND SO IT SAYS THAT,
UNFORTUNATELY, SOCIETY HAS MOVED
IN THIS DIRECTION SO STRONGLY OF
PRO-ABORTION, YOU CALL IT WHAT
YOU WANT, YOU COULD SAY NO, IT'S
JUST, YOU KNOW, WE'RE JUST
ALLOWING FREE CHOICE, BUT THE
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA ALONE
SINCE WE'VE HAD UPWARDS OF 40
MILLION ABORTIONS.
40 MILLION?
THAT IS A HUGE NUMBER, AND THE
FACT THAT IRELAND, A CATHOLIC
COUNTRY, A CHRISTIAN COUNTRY IS
GOING IN THAT DIRECTION IS
NOTHING TO CELEBRATE
NOTHING TO CELEBRATE.
PETE: ABRAHAM, YOU CALL IT A
PROTEST VOTE.
WHY?
>> WELL, I THINK WHAT WE'RE
LOOKING AT IN IRELAND IS AN
EMBRACE OF THE, YOU KNOW, EU
ENVIRONMENT.
IRELAND'S DONE VERY WELL BY
TAKING A LEAD IN THE EUROPEAN
UNION.
AND, YOU KNOW, AS AN ORTHODOX
RABBI IT'S NOT FOR ME TO COMMENT
ON WHICH A THE CHURCH SHOULD DO,
BUT CLEARLY THAT SOCIETY THAT
HAS MADE A MOVE AND NOW YOU HAVE
A CHURCH WHERE IT'S STILL A
PREDOMINANT FAITH, THERE'S
PREDOMINANT TEACHERS, BUT THERE
HAS TO BE A SHIFT IN TERMS OF
PERSUASION RATHER THAN THE
STARTING POINT, WELL, THESE ARE
THE RULES, YOU FOLLOW THEM, YOU
KNOW, OUR WAY OR OUT THE DOOR.
IT IS A PIVOTAL MOMENT.
PETE: SAMUEL, PIVOTAL MOMENT
OVERALL AS WELL, FROM AN
EVANGELICAL PERSPECTIVE, IS
PROGRESSIVISM CREEPING INTO OUR
FAITH?
AND IF SO, WHAT IMPACT IS THAT
HAVING ON NOT JUST IRELAND, BUT
AMERICA AND THE WORLD AT LARGE?
>> WELL, THE IDEA OF PROGRESSIVE
CHRISTIANITY IS OXYMORONIC IN
ITS DEPICTION AND ITS EXPRESSION
ITS DEPICTION AND ITS
EXPRESSION.
YOU CAN'T HAVE BOTH PROGRESSIVE
CHRISTIANITY.
LET ME EXPLAIN.
CHRISTIANITY IS ABOUT THE GOSPEL
THE GO TO SLEEP OF JESUS NEVER
CHANGES.
IT'S TRUTH, LOVE, GRACE, HOPE,
AND FAITH, REGARDLESS OF THE
TIME, THE CULTURE, SOCIETY.
TRUTH, LOVE, GRACE, AND HOPE
SHOULD NEVER BE SACRIFICED ON
THE ALTAR OF POLITICAL, CULTURAL
OR SEXUAL EXPEDIENCY
OR SEXUAL EXPEDIENCY.
PETE: ABSOLUTELY.
MENAZ, BRIEFLY ON THIS, WHAT
DOES ISLAM HAVE TO SAY ABOUT
ABORTION AND LIFE AS IT PERTAINS
NOT JUST TO IRELAND BUT THE
WHOLE ISSUE?
>> WELL, ISLAM, LIKE ALL THE
OTHER ABRAHAMIC FAITHS, BELIEVES
THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE IS A VALUE
OF HUMAN LIFE.
HOWEVER, IT'S ALSO A VERY
PRACTICAL RELIGION WHERE THERE
HAVE BEEN CERTAIN LEGAL SCHOLARS
THAT HAVE SAID THAT IF THERE IS
A DANGER OF MOTHER'S HEALTH OR
THERE IS SOME KIND OF DISEASE,
THAT IT IS PERMISSIBLE UNDER A
CERTAIN KIND OF LEGAL SITUATION.
IT'S NOT THAT MUSLIMS DON'T --
ARE PROMOTING ABORTION AT ALL,
BUT I THINK THAT THERE ARE
CERTAIN LOOPHOLES IN THE ISLAMIC
LAW, AND THERE ARE CERTAIN FATWA
LAW, AND THERE ARE CERTAIN
FATWAS WHICH IS JUST A LEGAL
OPINION FROM SCHOLARS THAT DO
ALLOW IT UNDER CERTAIN
CIRCUMSTANCES.
IT'S A VERY MULTILAYERED ISSUE.
I'M THE ONLY WOMAN HERE ON THE
PANEL SO I WOULD LIKE TO SAY
THAT IT IS AN ISSUE THAT'S VERY
COMPLEX FOR ALL WOMEN, WHETHER
THEY ARE PRO-ABORTION OR AGAINST
ABORTION.
PETE: OF COURSE.
>> I ALSO DON'T LIKE THE TERM "
>> I ALSO DON'T LIKE THE TERM
"PRO-ABORTION."
I DON'T THINK ANYONE IS PRO-
I DON'T THINK ANYONE IS
PRO-ABORTION.
I THINK WE'RE ALL PRO-LIFE AND
IT'S ABOUT HOW WE SEE LIFE IS
IMPORTANT TO US IN OUR FAITH
IMPORTANT TO US IN OUR FAITH.
PETE: ONE MORE TOPIC, TRY TO GET
YOU ALL TO CHIME IN ON IT
BRIEFLY.
IS THE U.S. PLUMMETING
BIRTHRIGHT A SIGN THAT A FOCUS
ON FAMILY VALUES ARE DIMINISHING
ON FAMILY VALUES ARE
DIMINISHING?
THE NEW STATS FROM THE NATIONAL
CENTER FOR HEALTH STATISTICS
SHOWS THAT LESS BABIES ARE BEING
BORN IN THE UNITED STATES.
THE REPLACEMENT RATE IS
GENERALLY TWO KIDS PER FAMILY,
BUT YOU SEE THOSE NUMBERS, THE
NUMBER OF BABIES BORN PER YEAR
IS DROPPING.
FATHER JOHN, LET ME START WITH
YOU.
THE STEREOTYPE OF COURSE IS THAT
CATHOLIC FAMILIES HAVE LOTS OF
KIDS.
IF THAT IS CHANGING, WOULD THAT
BE A SIGN THAT THE VIEW OF
FAMILIES IS CHANGING FOR
CATHOLICS AS WELL?
>> I THINK SO.
I MEAN, I THINK THE SEXUAL
REVOLUTION HAS AFFECTED THE
CATHOLIC CHURCH, THE UNITED
STATES OF AMERICA IN A PROFOUND
WAY, SAYING SEX HAS NOTHING TO
DO WITH PROCREATION.
AND IT'S NOT ALL ABOUT
PROCREATION.
IT'S ALSO ABOUT THE UNITIV
ACTION, BUT THERE'S ALSO VERY
PRACTICAL POLITICAL THINGS THAT
ARE CHANGING IN THE UNITED
STATES.
FOR EXAMPLE, PEOPLE ARE
GRADUATING FROM COLLEGE WITH
$200,000 OF DEBT, AND ARE THEY
GOING TO GET MARRIED TO SOMEBODY
WHO HAS $200,000 OF DEBT AND
START OFF A FAMILY THAT'S
$400,000 OF DEBT AND HAVE
CHILDREN?
IT'S NOT EASY.
THAT'S WHY POLITICS MATTER.
ALSO VERY IMPORTANT THINGS LIKE
FAMILY LIFE
FAMILY LIFE.
PETE: ABRAHAM, FOR EACH OF YOU
WITHIN I WANT TO GET YOU ALL IN,
I DON'T HAVE THAT MUCH TIME YET.
WHAT IS ABOUT BIRTHRATE THAT
MATTERS IN DEMOGRAPHICS?
>> TAKE A LOOK AT OUR TWO ALLIES
JAPAN AND ISRAEL.
JAPAN'S VERY AFFLUENT.
THEY'RE PROBABLY GOING TO GO
FROM 130 MILLION TO 80 MILLION
PEOPLE.
THEY'RE NOT BRINGING CHILDREN
INTO THE WORLD.
I THINK THEY'VE LOST THEIR
VALUES.
ISRAEL, YOU YOU GUYS COVER THEM
EVERY DAY, IT'S UNDER THE GUN,
EXISTENTIAL THREATS.
THE BIRTHRATE AMONG RELIGIOUS
AND SECULAR PEOPLE IS GOING UP
BECAUSE THEY HAVE A SENSE OF
THEIR PAST AND FUTURE.
AS FAR AS AMERICA, IT'S CALLED
THE iPHONE.
THIS IS THE ME GENERATION.
MY SUGGESTION IS SHUT THE DAMN
THING OFF AND GO BACK TO BASIC
VALUES
VALUES.
PETE: SAMUEL, WHY DO KIDS MATTER
PETE: SAMUEL, WHY DO KIDS
MATTER?
>> KIDS MATTER.
IT'S A DE FACTO OUTCOME OF A
CONSTANT MOCKERY OF THE
INSTITUTION OF THE FAMILY.
WE SEE THAT CULTURALLY IN FILMS
AND MOVIE AND CONTENT, IN
WRITINGS, PUBLICATIONS, SOCIAL
MEDIA.
THE FAMILY NOW IS A JOKE, AND
EVEN THE IDEA OF A MODERN FAMILY
A TRADITIONAL FAMILY FOR
WHATEVER -- HOWEVER YOU WANT TO
DESCRIBE IT IS A JOKE.
SO IT'S UNDER ASSAULT, KIDS
MATTER, IT'S THE FUTURE OF
AMERICA, THE FUTURE OF MORALITY
AND SPIRITUALITY, THE FUTURE OF
OUR HUMAN EXISTENCE INDEED
OUR HUMAN EXISTENCE INDEED.
PETE: MENAZ, YOU SPECULATE THAT
THE ECONOMY HAS SOMETHING TO DO
WITH BIRTHRATES AS WELL.
>> ABSOLUTELY.
I MEAN, I THINK IF YOU LOOK AT
STATISTICS AND IF YOU LOOK AT
DATA, WOMEN ARE HAVING KIDS
LATER, WOMEN HAVE TROUBLE HAVING
KIDS LATER BECAUSE THEY'RE
LOOKING FOR A PROFESSIONAL LIFE.
THEY HAVE TO BOTH BE WORKING, A
MAN AND WOMAN OR ANY KIND OF
RELATIONSHIP YOU HAVE TO BOTH
HAVE INCOMES.
I THINK THE ECONOMIC FACTOR IN
THE UNITED STATES MAKES IT VERY
HARD FOR MIDDLE CLASS AND LOWER
MIDDLE CLASS FAMILIES TO HAVE A
WHOLE REALISTIC ECONOMIC PLAN.
AND I THINK THAT PEOPLE ARE
GETTING MARRIED LATER, EVEN IN
THE MUSLIM-AMERICAN COMMUNITY I
SEE THIS AS A BIG IMPACT
SEE THIS AS A BIG IMPACT.
PETE: IT'S AN AMAZING CULTURAL
CONVERSATION BECAUSE IN THE WEST
FAMILIES ARE HAVING LESS KIDS,
BUT A LOT OF THE REFUGEE OR
IMMIGRANT POPULATIONS MOVING
INTO THOSE COUNTRIES ARE HAVING
MORE KIDS, WHICH CHANGES THE
WHOLE RELIGIOUS, CULTURAL, AND
SOCIAL DYNAMIC IN THOSE
COUNTRIES.
IT TRULY MATTERS.
WE'RE GOING TO HAVE YOU GUYS
BACK, I HAVE A FEELING, ON