INSTEAD OF MEETING WITH POMPEO WHEN HE GOES OVER THERE BECAUSE
TRUMP GAVE THEM EVERYTHING THEY
WANTED IN THE FIRST MEETING.
NOW, LET’S TURN TO THE FISA
WARRANTS AND CARTER PAGE.
FOR THE FIRST TIME IN THE
HISTORY OF THE 40-YEAR-OLD
SECRET COURT THAT WAS
ESTABLISHED BY THE FOREIGN
INTELLIGENCE SURVEILLANCE ACT,
DOCUMENTS THAT SUPPORTED A
WARRANT WERE RELEASED THIS
WEEKEND.
WEEKEND. A FREEDOM OF INFORMATION ACT
LAWSUIT DISCLOSED THE OCTOBER,
2016, APPLICATION TO WIRETAP
CARTER PAGE.
CARTER PAGE. A TRUMP CAMPAIGN FOREIGN POLICY
ADVISER.
ADVISER. ALONG WITH SEVERAL RENEWAL
APPLICATIONS AFTER DONALD TRUMP
DECLASSIFIED THEIR EXISTENCE
EARLIER THIS YEAR.
AMONG HIS 400 PAGES, MANY OF
WHICH ARE REDACTED, THE
APPLICATION STATES, QUOTE, THE
FBI BELIEVES PAGE HAS BEEN THE
SUBJECT OF TARGETED RECRUITMENT
BY THE RUSSIAN GOVERNMENT.
AND IDENTIFIES PAGE AS A FORMER
FOREIGN POLICY ADVISER TO A
CANDIDATE FOR PRESIDENT.
IT SAYS, QUOTE, THE FBI BELIEVES
THE RUSSIAN GOVERNMENT’S EFFORTS
ARE BEING COORDINATED WITH PAGE
AND PERHAPS OTHER INDIVIDUALS
ASSOCIATED WITH THAT CAMPAIGN.
AND THE FBI BELIEVES THAT PAGE
HAS BEEN COLLABORATING AND
CONSPIREING WITH THE RUSSIAN
GOVERNMENT.
GOVERNMENT. PAGE CALLED THE CLAIMS
RIDICULOUS AND SO MISLEADING.
THE APPLICATION USED THE STEELE
DOSSIER’S THAT HE SPOKE WITH
RUSSIAN OFFICIALS LIFTING
SANCTIONS.
SANCTIONS. THOUGH THE UNREDACTED PORTION
SHOWS IT USED OTHER MATERIALS AS
WELL.
WELL. THE APPLICATION AND ITS RENEWAL
SHOW THAT ALL OF THE JUDGES WHO
SIGNED OFF ON THE WIRETAPPING
WERE APPOINTED BY, WAIT FOR IT,
WAIT FOR IT, WAIT FOR IT, ANGRY
REPUBLICAN PRESIDENTS.
REPUBLICAN PRESIDENTS. PART OF DONALD TRUMP’S 13 ANGRY
PEOPLE IN THE INVESTIGATION YOU
CAN -- 4 OF THOSE 13 YOU CAN
ACTUALLY PUT DOWN AS 4
REPUBLICAN JUDGES.
REPUBLICAN JUDGES. THERE’S SO MUCH TO GO TO HERE,
BEN WITTIS, FIRST OF ALL, AS A
PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT TO
87 MILLION PEOPLE WATCHING AND
LISTENING ON ARMED FORCES RADIO
ACROSS THE WORLD, I’M MAKING
THAT UP, TELL US JUST HOW
DRAMATIC A CHANGE FROM PRECEDENT
IT WAS TO HAVE THE FISA MADE
PUBLIC AND THE GRAVE RISKS THAT
GO ALONG WITH THAT AND THEN
WE’LL ASK YOU MORE ABOUT THE
CARTER PAGE APPLICATION.
>> YEAH, SO.
I THINK THE ANSWER TO THE
QUESTION, HOW UNUSUAL IS IT IS
THAT IT’S COMPLETELY
UNPRECEDENTED.
UNPRECEDENTED. 20 PLUS YEARS AGO WHEN I WAS A
VERY YOUNG REPORTER FOR A LEGAL
NEWSPAPER, I DID WHAT I THINK IS
THE FIRST SORT OF MAJOR STORY
ABOUT THE FOREIGN INTELLIGENCE
SURVEILLANCE COURT IN THE MID
1990s.
1990s. AT THE TIME, THE JUSTICE
DEPARTMENT MADE A DECISION TO
COOPERATE WITH THE STORY, AS DID
THE COURT, BY THE WAY.
AND THEY ALL TALKED ON THE
RECORD AND WE HAD A LOT OF
CONVERSATIONS ABOUT FISA.
THE ONE THING I ASKED FOR THAT
THEY SAID NO WAY, NO HOW YOU’RE
NEVER GOING TO GET WAS THE WORD
PROCESSING TEMPLATE FOR A FISA
APPLICATION, THAT IS NOT ONLY
WERE THEY NOT WILLING TO GIVE
LIKE A USED APPLICATION WITH
EVERYTHING REDACTED, THEY
WEREN’T EVEN WILLING TO LET ME
SEE THE MOCKUP THAT THEY WRITE
OFF OF THAT SHOWS THE STRUCTURE
OF IT, WHICH IS IF YOU TAKE ALL
THE MATERIAL OUT, ESSENTIALLY
WHAT THIS IS, IN ADDITION, THIS
HAS THE NAME OF A TARGET IN IT,
WHICH -- AND IT HAS A LOT OF THE
MATERIAL THAT THEY USED TO
SUPPORT THE APPLICATION.
SO IT’S COMPLETELY
UNPRECEDENTED.
UNPRECEDENTED. IT’S A HUGE CHANGE.
AND IT REFLECTS THE DEGREE TO
WHICH THE PRESIDENT HAS BY
TALKING ABOUT THIS PROCESS IN A
FALSE FASHION FORCED THE RELEASE
OF INFORMATION.
OF INFORMATION. AND THE WAY DEVIN NUNES HAS BY
TALKING ABOUT THIS INFORMATION
FALSELY FORCED THE DEPARTMENT TO
CONTEMPLATE THE RELEASE OF
TRUTHFUL INFORMATION THAT CAN
ITSELF BE VERY DAMAGING.
>> AND CAROL LEE, WHAT DID WE
FIND OUT FROM THE DOCUMENTS THAT
WERE RELEASED FROM THE JUSTICE
DEPARTMENT?
DEPARTMENT? >> WELL, A NUMBER OF THINGS,
INCLUDING SOME OF WHICH YOU
READ, WHICH IS THAT THERE WAS A
VERY CLEAR DIRECTIVE -- THERE
WAS A VERY CLEAR BELIEF THAT
CARTER PAGE WAS CONSPIREING WITH
RUSSIA TO IN WAYS THAT WERE
NEFARIOUS AND ALSO THAT THE
RENEWALS OF THIS FISA WARRANT
SUGGEST THAT PART IS REDACTED
AND WE DON’T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT
WAS LEARNED, THAT LED TO THOSE
RENEWALS OF THE FISA WARRANT,
THEY SHOW THE NUMBER OF PAGES
THAT THE APPLICATION WAS GREW
EACH TIME, SO THERE WAS
INFORMATION THAT CLEARLY THEY
HAD LEARNED IN SURVEILLING HIM
THAT LED TO RENEWALS.
SO I THINK THE MAIN QUESTION
COMING OUT OF WHEN YOU LOOK AT
WHAT WAS RELEASED IS WHAT WAS
THAT?
THAT? AND MAYBE WE’LL LEARN THAT IN
COMING MONTHS AND MAYBE WE
WON’T, BUT THERE WAS VERY
CLEARLY, YOU KNOW, IT KIND OF
DEBUNKS WHAT THE PRESIDENT HAD
SAID THAT, YOU KNOW, THE
REPUBLICAN MEMO THAT WAS
RELEASED THAT HAD EXONERATED HIM
OR SHOW THAT THERE WAS SOMETHING
THAT THIS WAS NOT DONE IN A
PROPER WAY, IT CERTAINLY IS
ANOTHER INSTANCE WHERE THAT IS
DEBUNKED AND SHOWS THERE WAS A
REAL CAUSE FOR THIS.
>> BENJAMIN WITTES, OBVIOUSLY
THE PRESIDENT’S TWEET THIS
WEEKEND CLAIMING THAT THE
DOCUMENTS EXONERATED HIM WERE
RIDICULOUS, NOT FACT BASED TO
SAY THE LEAST.
TALK ABOUT WHAT YOUR MAIN TAKE
AWAY WAS FROM THE FISA DOCUMENTS
RELEASED THIS WEEKEND.
>> WELL, I GUESS MY MAIN TAKE
AWAY IS THAT THIS IS PRETTY MUCH
WHAT I ALWAYS IMAGINED A FISA
APPLICATION WOULD LOOK LIKE,
WHICH IS TO SAY PACKED WITH
INFORMATION.
INFORMATION. YOU KNOW, IT IS NOT IN SUPPORT
OF A CRIMINAL CONVICTION, RIGHT?
THE FACT THAT SOME OF THE
INFORMATION PEOPLE MALATER RAISE
QUESTIONS ABOUT, THEY’RE ONLY
TRYING TO ESTABLISH PROBABLE
CAUSE FOR PURPOSES OF A WARRANT,
SURVEILLANCE WARRANT, NOT PROVE
THE GUY GUILTY OF A CRIME TO
LOCK HIM UP, BUT IT’S PACKED
WITH INFORMATION.
WITH INFORMATION. SOME OF WHICH WE CAN SEE, SOME
OF WHICH IS REDACTED.
SOME OF WHICH INVOLVES HIGHLY
SENSITIVE INTELLIGENCE SOURCES.
SOME OF WHICH IS SO SENSITIVE
IT’S BLACKED OUT.
AND I THINK THE MOST IMPORTANT
POINT IS THAT THERE WERE
MULTIPLE RENEWALS.
MULTIPLE RENEWALS. EACH RENEWAL GROWS IN THE
PACKAGE GROWS.
PACKAGE GROWS. IM
IM IMPLYING THEY’RE GETTING NEW
INFORMATION ALONG THE WAY.
AT NO POINT DOES EITHER THE
JUSTICE DEPARTMENT HIERARCHY OR
THE COURT SAY, HEY, WAIT A
MINUTE, THIS MATERIAL ISN’T GOOD
ENOUGH TO SUPPORT THE
SURVEILLANCE THAT YOU’RE
REQUESTING.
REQUESTING. SO I THINK IT’S -- IT REALLY
DOES GIVE THE LIE TO BOTH THE
PRESIDENT AND THE HOUSE
REPUBLICANS CLAIMS THAT THERE
WAS SOMETHING FE FAIR MOUSE OR
INAPPROPRIATE HERE.
INAPPROPRIATE HERE. >> YEAH.
>> YEAH. JOHN HEILEMANN, I WANTED TO
FOLLOW UP WITH YOU ABOUT THE
LIES FROM DEVIN NUNES, PAUL
RYAN, THE HOUSE REPUBLICANS.
>> YES, PLEASE.
>> I REMEMBER WHEN I FIRST RAN
IN 1994, NOT ONLY MYSELF BUT
PROBABLY EVERY OTHER REPUBLICAN
ACROSS AMERICA WAS STILL
ATTACKING THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY
BECAUSE OF THEIR ATTACKS ON THE
INTEL COMMUNITY THROUGHOUT THE
1960s AND 1970s.
THE CHURCH COMMISSION.
YOU GO DOWN THE LINE, WE SAID
THE DEMOCRATS WERE
INSUFFICIENTLY LOYAL TO THE
INTEL COMMUNITIES AND DAMAGED
THEIR ABILITY TO GO OUT ACROSS
THE WORLD AND DO THE IMPORTANT
WORK THEY NEEDED TO DO TO
PROTECT AMERICANS.
PROTECT AMERICANS. WELL, I JUST I CANNOT BELIEVE
THAT WHAT THE REPUBLICANS ARE
DOING NOW, WHAT PAUL RYAN HAS
ALLOWED TO HAPPEN, WHAT DEVIN
NUNES ACTING AS A USEFUL IDIOT
FOR THE RUSSIAN GOVERNMENT, AT
THE VERY LEAST, WHAT THEY DID
THIS LAST WEEK TRYING TO DEFEND
THE INDEFENSIBLE WITH DONALD
TRUMP ACTUALLY ADOPTING SOVIET
FOREIGN POLICY THAT ATTEMPTS TO
BREAK UP NATO INSTEAD OF 50, 60
YEARS OF U.S. POLICY, I CAN’T
BELIEVE THAT DOESN’T STICK TO
REPUBLICANS NOT ONLY IN THE
MIDTERMS BUT FOR THE NEXT 30
YEARS.
YEARS. >> I THINK MAYBE THE NEXT 30
YEARS IS MORE IMPORTANT THING
THAN THE MIDTERMS.
I DON’T KNOW HOW IT WILL PLAY
OUT IN THE MIDTERMS.
I WANT TO PICK UP ON THAT
BECAUSE WHAT BEN WITTES SAID A
SECOND AGO.
SECOND AGO. LOOK, WE KNOW THE PRESIDENT IS A
LIAR, HE LIES PATHOLOGICALLY ON
A DAILY BASIS AND MAYBE THIS
THING I’M ABOUT TO SAY IS ALSO
NOT NEWS, BUT NOTHING, NOTHING
THAT HAS HAPPENED OVER THE
COURSE OF THE LAST 18 MONTHS IS
MORE VIVIDLY DEMONSTRATED THE
EXTENT TO WHICH THE HOUSE
REPUBLICANS ON THAT INTEL
COMMITTEE AND PARTICULARLY DEVIN
NUNES ARE ENGAGED IN NOTHING
OTHER THAN A TRANSPARENT EFFORT
TO LIE, PREVARICATE, THROW UP
FOG, THROW UP SMOKE IN ORDER TO
TRY TO PROTECT THIS PRESIDENT
RATHER THAN DOING THEIR JOB.
THIS IS AN EXTRAORDINARY THING
SEEING ALL THIS DOCUMENTATION,
BUT IT REALLY JUST MAKES CLEAR
AGAIN IF IT WASN’T CLEAR ENOUGH
ALREADY, THE EXTENT TO WHICH
DEVIN NUNES, THE CHAIRMAN OF
THAT COMMITTEE, A COMMITTEE IN
THE PAST HAS DONE GREAT,
IMPORTANT, BIPARTISAN WORK HAS
BECOME COMPLETELY CORRUPTED BY
WHATEVER.
WHATEVER. YOU CAN SPEND ALL DAY SPECULATED
ABOUT WHAT THAT CORRUPTION, THE
SOURCE OF THAT CORRUPTION IS,
BUT THIS SHOWS THE EXTENT TO
WHICH THIS GUY, WHO SAID HE
HADN’T READ THE DOCUMENTS HE
ADMITTED AT THE TIME AND YET WAS
WILLING TO CAST ASPERSIONS ON
THE INTEL COMMITTEE AND STAND UP
AND SAY CARTER PAGE, I’M SURE
HE’S FINE AND IT’S ALL ABOUT THE
STEELE DOSSIER.
STEELE DOSSIER. ALL OBLITERATED BY THE
DOCUMENTS.
DOCUMENTS. MICHAEL SCHMIDT, HOW IS IT
THAT -- REALLY ONE OF THE THINGS
THAT MOST BAFFLES ME IS HOW AT
THIS POINT 18 MONTHS IN, GIVEN
PAUL RYAN SUPPORTING THEM, HOW
IS IT THAT THAT COMMITTEE IS
EVEN A FUNCTIONAL THING ANYMORE
OR IS IT NOW JUST SOMETHING THAT
HAS NO RELEVANCE WHATSOEVER
EXCEPT IN THE POLITICAL REALM
AND HAS NOTHING DO WITH THE
OVERSIGHT OF THE INTELLIGENCE
COMMITTEE OR ANYTHING THAT
TOUCHES THE INTELLIGENCE
COMMUNITY?
COMMUNITY? >> WELL, IT REALLY ISN’T.
AND THEY DON’T WORK TOGETHER ON
ANYTHING.
ANYTHING. THEY SPEND A LOT OF THEIR TIME
CABLE TELEVISION ATTACKING EACH
OTHER.
OTHER. IT’S PRETTY MUCH JUST A
POLITICAL THING.
POLITICAL THING. IT’S WHERE THE POLITICAL FIGHT
ABOUT THE TRUMP RUSSIA STORY
GOES ON ON A DAILY BASIS.
I CAN’T SEE ANY OF THAT CHANGES
UNDER THE CURRENT CIRCUMSTANCES.
THERE HAD BEEN SOME EXPECTATION
AFTER THE ELECTION THAT THERE
WOULD BE THIS BIPARTISAN EFFORT
TO GET TO THE BOTTOM OF WHAT
HAPPENED.
HAPPENED. WE SEE MORE OF THAT ON THE
SENATE SIDE WHERE THE SENATE
INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE IS DOING
AN INVESTIGATION FAR LESS NOISE,
FAR LESS FIGHTING, SOME MORE
HEARINGS, A LITTLE MORE
TRANSPARENCY, A LITTLE MORE IDEA
THAT THEY ARE WORKING TOGETHER
AT THE SAME TIME, THEY HAVE NOT
COMPLETED THEIR INVESTIGATION.
MUELLER’S INVESTIGATION GOES ON.
WE DO NOT HAVE A 9/11-STYLE
COMMISSION THAT WOULD PRODUCE
SOME SORT OF LARGE REPORT FOR
THE PUBLIC ON THIS.
SO, IT ALLOWS DIFFERENT NOTIONS,
CONSPIRACY THEORIES, FALSE
NARRATIVES TO CONTINUE
ESPECIALLY OUT OF THAT
COMMITTEE.
COMMITTEE. >> YEAH, MIKE BARNACLE, IT SEEMS
TO ME PICKING UP ON WHAT JOHN
HEILEMANN JUST SAID AND MICHAEL
SCHMIDT THAT WHERE WE ARE
HEADED, IF YOU ARE READING THE
TEA LEAVES AND BELIEVE THAT THE
DEMOCRATS ARE GOING TO TAKE OVER
THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, I
THINK MOST PEOPLE WOULD SUGGEST
THAT THEY WOULD, EVEN
HISTORICALLY IF YOU LOOK AT THE
NUMBERS OF SEATS THAT A SITTING
PRESIDENT LOSES, DEMOCRATS ARE
GOING TO MOST LIKELY TAKE OVER
THE HOUSE AND BECAUSE OF THE
MAP, REPUBLICANS PROBABLY WILL
HOLD ON TO THE SENATE, COULD
HOLD ON TO THE SENATE.
WHAT WE’RE PROBABLY GOING TO SEE
NEXT YEAR, IF THE ODDS PLAY OUT
THE WAY MOST PEOPLE SUSPECT THEY
ARE, IS YOU’RE GOING TO SEE A
BIPARTISAN, BICAMERAL
BIPARTISAN, BICAMERAL INVESTIGATION INTO RUSSIA LED BY
RICHARD BURR, REPUBLICAN FROM
NORTH CAROLINA ON THE SENATE
SIDE AND DEMOCRAT TO BE NAMED
LATER, POSSIBLY ADAM SCHIFF, BUT
A DEMOCRAT TO BE NAMED LATER
FROM THE HOUSE OF
REPRESENTATIVES ON THE HOUSE
SIDE.
SIDE. AND SO, YOU HAVE ONE REPUBLICAN
WHO HAS BEEN A STRAIGHT SHOOTER
ALL ALONG.
ALL ALONG. A DEMOCRAT FROM THE HOUSE AND
YOU SPEND THE NEXT YEAR GETTING
TO THE BOTTOM OF THIS IN GOOD
FAITH FIGURING WHAT HAPPENED,
WHEN IT HAPPENED, WHAT DID THE
PRESIDENT KNOW AND WHEN DID HE
KNOW IT.
KNOW IT. >> YEAH, JOE.
THAT’S GOING TO BE A PRIORITY.
EVERYTHING WE HAVE SPOKEN ABOUT
HERE IN THE FIRST 20 MINUTES IS
OF CRITICAL, NATIONAL
IMPORTANCE.
IMPORTANCE. THERE’S NO DOUBT ABOUT IT, IRAN
TWEET, CARTER PAGE, THE FISA
WARRANTS.
WARRANTS. BUT RIGHT UP THERE, RIGHT UP
THERE IS THE CORRUPTION OF THE
PROCESS THAT HAS TAKEN PLACE IN
THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
OVER THE PAST 18 MONTHS WITH
PAUL RYAN, THE SPEAKER OF THE
HOUSE, REPUBLICAN SPEAKER OF THE
HOUSE, ALLOWING AND IN SOME
CASES ENCOURAGING DEVIN NUNES TO
CARRY ON A CONCERTED AND
CONSISTENT EFFORT TO OBSTRUCT
JUSTICE USING A HOUSE COMMITTEE.
>> AND BEN WITTES, WE HAVE TO GO
TO BREAK, BUT IT’S MORE THAN
JUST OBSTRUCTING JUSTICE FOR
DONALD TRUMP.
DONALD TRUMP. WHAT DEVIN NUNES HAS DONE WITH
THE HELP OF PAUL RYAN THROUGH
THIS FISA PROCESS HAS UNDERMINED
OUR INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY,
UNDERMINED INTELLIGENCE
UNDERMINED INTELLIGENCE GATHERING, AND REVEALED NOT ONLY
TO RUSSIANS BUT TO MEMBERS OF AL
QAEDA, TO MEMBERS OF IRAN’S
REVOLUTIONARY GUARD, TO MEMBERS
OF ISIS A PART OF OUR INTEL
PROCESS THAT WE’VE HIDDEN FOR 40
YEARS.
YEARS. >> YEAH.
>> YEAH. HE’S DONE A LOT OF THINGS HERE.
HE HAS REALLY SHOWN THAT THE
UNITED STATES’ INTELLIGENCE
COMMUNITY CANNOT PROTECT SOURCES
FROM CONGRESS AND THAT CONGRESS
WILL OUT THEM AND FORCE THE
INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY TO OUT
THEM.
THEM. HE HAS ALSO REALLY TAKEN A
SLEDGE HAMMER TO THE
INTELLIGENCE OVERSIGHT SYSTEM,
WHICH WAS BUILT IN THE WAKE OF
WATERGATE IN ORDER TO PREVENT
THE INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY FROM
RUNNING AMOK AND ABUSING
PEOPLE’S CIVIL LIBERTIES.
IF YOU DON’T HAVE A FUNCTIONING
CONGRESSIONAL INTELLIGENCE
CONGRESSIONAL INTELLIGENCE OVERSIGHT SYSTEM, THEN WHAT
ACTUALLY PREVENTS THE
INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY FROM
BEHAVING BADLY?
BEHAVING BADLY? SO IT’S REALLY AN ATTACK NOT
JUST ON THE EFFECTIVENESS OF THE
INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY, BUT ALSO
ON THE ABILITY TO MONITOR THE
INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY WHICH IS,
OF COURSE, PRECISELY WHAT HE
PURPORTS TO BE DOING.
>> DEVIN NUNES AND HIS CLOSE
FRIEND PAUL RYAN DID THIS ALL IN
DEFENSE OF THE INDEFENSIBLE.
I HOPE THAT WORKS WELL FOR THEM