and in the west from the Walter
Cronkite school of journalism at
Arizona state university.
Amna: Montana became the first
state to ban tiktok yesterday,
citing fears that the app's
chinese-owned parent company
could be providing Americans'
data to the Chinese government.
Montana could be a testing
ground for other state and
national leaders also
considering bans on the nation's
fastest-growing app.
Correspondent: The first of its
kind law bans mobile of from
hosting tiktok on their
platforms and Montana.
Violations could mean fine for
the companies and for tiktok is
someone is offered the ability
to access the platform or
download the app.
The bill's signing came after
months of debate in the state
legislature, with proponents
arguing that the app and its
Chinese based parent company
bytedance is a threat to
national security.
>> This app steals data from
users and its ability to share
that data with the Chinese
communist party is unacceptable
infringes on Montana's rights to
privacy.
>> There is nothing stopping the
social media company based in
America from collecting the same
data, selling it to a Chinese
organization, and then then
being held to that company.
Correspondent: The company has
repeatedly denied it sure is
user information with the
Chinese government.
A tiktok spokeswoman push back
in a statement saying the law
infringes on the first amendment
rights of Montana residents and
that the company will defend the
rights of our users inside and
outside of Montana.
While Montana is the first day
to outright ban the app, it is
not the only one to take action.
Tiktok has been banned on
federal government devices.
In March president Biden urged
tiktok to the vest itself from
Chinese owners or face a
nationwide ban.
U.S. Lawmakers grow the
company's CEO in a heated
hearing.
>> Your platform should be
banned.
>> Tiktok needs to be an
American company with American
values.
>> Bytedance is not owned by the
Chinese government.
An American company on American
soil overseen by American
personnel.
Correspondent: Chinese officials
said they would firmly oppose a
forced sale.
Montana's ban is scheduled to
take a place on January 2024.
In a statement aclu of Montana
said the governor and the state
legislature trampled on the free
speech of hundreds of thousands
of montanans who use the apps to
express themselves, gather
information, and render small
business in the name of
anti-chaney's -- Chinese
sentiment.
A group of content creators
filed suit against Montana in an
effort to block the ban of the
app.
Following the events closely is
Bobby Allyn, he covers
technology and business for NPR.
Before we get into the legal
battles, I want to talk to you
about Montana's move
specifically targeting one at --
app.
Have we seen anything like that?
>> No, there is really no
precedent for this.
Tech experts are stunned this
happened at all.
It is going to be hard to
enforce, because the way that
this technology operates is if
you take out your phone and you
pull up tiktok, it pains a cell
phone tower that talks to tiktok
servers.
Imagine you are in a border town
in Wyoming or Idaho, and you are
in Montana -- near Montana and
you pull up tiktok and it is
being to the server and you
cannot access it because of this
ban.
There is a lot of technical --
this will be a hard thing to
really enforce because of that.
Amna: They are not going after
users.
They are going after companies,
they are holding companies in
the platforms responsible, which
would seem to imply Google and
apple would have to comply for
this enforcement to work.
Do we know they would want to
cooperate?
>> Apple and Google have not
said anything about the Montana
tiktok ban, but the penalties
would be assessed to them.
They could be fined $10,000 per
day if they do not block tiktok
from being downloaded on Google
play and apple app stores.
The question is are they going
to comply, are they going to
resist.
This will play out in the
courts, but this is spitting a
huge roar between Montana state
officials and Google.
Amna: We have the first lawsuit,
five tiktok content creators
suing to overturn the law.
Is there any precedent that
tells us how the courts might
view this issue?
>> It is going to be a balancing
act between the national
security concerns and the first
amendment rights of tiktok users
and creators, and I think courts
have said is directly expressing
yourself politically or
otherwise on a social media
platforms is protected speech
under the first amendment.
That said, there are some ways
in which the government can
restrict speech if an app or
social media platforms is found
to be providing material support
to terrorists.
You can put restrictions on
speech in that situation.
Supporters of tiktok says there
is no convincing evidence tiktok
poses a national security threat
, and a lot of years the Chinese
government can use tiktok to spy
or lunch disinformation
campaigns is theoretical.
This will come down to the
federal judge that takes a look
at this case and decides is it
more of a national security
threat, or should we protect the
free speech rights of users.
Amna: Even if it is not fully
enforceable or struck down in
the courts, are you already
seeing any kind of impact when
it comes to usage?
>> You are, I am seeing tiktok
users who have large followings
saying follow me on YouTube.
Let's go to Instagram.
Let's go to read it, some other
platform that is going to be
safe come January 2024.
Tiktok is saying, listen
everyone in Montana, do not
worry.
We will block this in the
courts.
Tiktok is encouraging tiktok
users to just go about your day
as you usually do, use the
platform as much as you want,
but users are looking for
alternatives, because this is
real.
The governor signed a law
banning tiktok within the
borders of Montana.
If you were someone who derives
all of your income from tiktok,
you will be concerned about
this.
Some of those creators to the
course today and sued Montana
saying you are depriving us of
the ability to be freely
expressive on this platform and
depriving us of income.
Amna: We have heard a number of
other leaders at the state and
national level expressing
concerns over tiktok.
Do you see other states
following suit?
>> We saw states ban tiktok on
government devices, and after a
few did many followed suit.
In states that have governors
that are Republicans and
Democrats, this issue about an
ascendant China, China being a
real national security threat is
a real bipartisan concern, so a
lot of states and the Biden
white house will be watching to
see how this plays out in the
courts.
If the courts to approve this,
you are going to bleed for sure
that other governors are going
to follow suit, and the Biden
white house might even be
watching to see, hey, if the
courts allow the Montana ban to
go through, maybe we can push a
national ban.
Amna: That is Bobby Allyn
joining us tonight.
Good to talk to you.
♪♪