set day
center elizabeth warren has introduced
aid bill
new extend or i should say
to drop
the uh...
lowered the student interest rates from
maha for one year from three point four percent two-point seven five percent
for student loans for higher education
we know that within a couple of months uh... the alone rate will double to six
point eight percent
our next guest uh...
will um... will will talk to us about why that very well may be missing the
point i imagine we all think it's a good thing but uh...
uh... on the phone i had some air santi he is a graduate student in the
university of california santa barbara he is a member of the ta union
system-wide
and also a contributor to
jacqueline he has written a piece on onsite dot org
going back to class why we need to make university free and how we can do is to
mir welcome to the program
okay i'm going to happen
so hard somewhere let's start with uh... with peter drucker you start your piece
uh... like talking about him and his perspective as
who are what's the and uh...
what uh... oh
why start with him
prepare what they are used for a bit
i get these you keep now compared to the father of our management science sort of
what all up
undergraduate an m_d_ eighty student some young business logic either country
learn the medicare introductory management courses tom
it was pretty important on for a few deriving the signs of management in the
twentieth century the external overtime a general motors
reading a book about about the corporation com
and i think that in the fifties are meant to end the debate agree you don't
forget on his head academically i at m_i_t_ prerogative academic and part of
his professional arm
activity he did not come when you think of as as an advocate a-bomb
expanded public sector special sort of internet
but then i agree with him today doctor julie cooper executives talking about
expanding the public sector it's mostly about cutting it
but he arm he it was
known enemies off in the sixties on he was a big advocate of
expanding higher education and access to higher education
making sure students you know of all income background could go to college on
the computer believed that
that the u_s_ with entering a twenty point twenty country a knowledge economy
toward moving past
industrial pkwy
and that that occasion for a for young people are gonna be gentle so he would
actually advocate of around the state are paying for everyone to go to college
and into the gag rule com
you know who's maybe not if not a friend of trade unions on a friend of of the
left by any stretch of imagination but
i decided so striking a misunderstanding past fifty years that we got a guy group
premature
the kruger four for modern managers are medicaid entry by red so that that sort
of i've started with that in in the peace
and there's this really to arguments that um... brian
parallel uh...
in this argument that uh... universities
uh... should be free and that is the one that this perspective ah... of
aid a member of the corporate class if you will um... who's saying that uh...
just in terms of society from a for practical standpoint it makes much more
sense there's also the argument uh... that you the that you you make an almost
in some respects simply just uh... state as uh... stipulate that
uh...
by its very nature
we want a citizenry that uh... is educated
italiana absolutely i mean i think current and then arianna andrea one
margin i want i want to make here is that on
higher education education generally shouldn't be about training young people
for the work force it shouldn't be about human capital advancement omg
now to be about having you know an educated citizenry that that can make
you know
period but they didn't think about politics mysterious way and that
had the opportunity to learn to difficult learning com we've got so many
the incredible people on capitol cross the country into a tragedy that and more
young people aren't able to sort of just going study what they want arm
and then i guess you know that's a relief to you know my experience
teaching on campus we see so many young people
going in the majors in studying pent up if you are going to prepare them to get
a copy pre-op explodes and um... that
enough i what i think it should be about uh...
enrollment imaginative is dropping pushes though uh... a pretty big
reflection of that time and we see more and more kidney adrian finance and
economics not not that there's anything inherently wrong with them doing that
but
uh... i don't think that most of the decisions are made the out of
intellectual interested so i think more sort of material imperative
yeah i mean it's uh... you know i i ask that because only because on this
program we tend to have a lot of libertarian callers call in
and uh...
date simply do not accept that notion and maybe this is sort of where where
you know uh... it's one of those things where there's and not necessarily
um... a uh... in a sort of a
uh... a perfect argument to make a it's one of those things that people see that
you could take as a tenants of of society or not that
uh... we should have anne uh... age uneducated
uh...
uh... citizenry flora the sake of having them educated as opposed to uh... to be
measured in terms of dollars uh...
but uh... i just wanted to mention that because that's something that's sort of
the
you stipulate uh... early in your pc and it is certainly for many of us it it's a
perfectly reasonable stipulation
but i want to point that out and you also sort of uh...
you you add that notion of there's also sort of these uh... those people who may
not
stipulated uh... simply for the sake of society but eh... for for the sake of of
uh... of the citizens but for the sake of of the broader society so let's talk
about uh... what why we now see such high debt and what is happened to the
education system over the past three uh... three decades or so
sorry i didn't believe you were in the student got really go back to the
nineteen seventies undergoing a major economic raked in seventy two ne sort of
one
austerity is we now understand that really arrived in the u_s_ um...
new york city if you have been a difficult right in the middle of that
decade and then across the country armed state budgets targeting flashed
and really i mean
basically they're spillway that college is paid for gratitude state
contributes resources or
individual to student of their family pays for it
so as state funding started to drop and in the nineteen seventy than really
really picked up from
and it was for a precipitous decline through seventies eighty to ninety but
into doubt indigenous
plummeted um... and so i had that happen to bend and in the student had to pick
up the burden and
the other side according to that during that period household income completely
stagnated
we've imperial increasing wages basically at all since the nineteen
seventies um
i believe his nineteen seventy three real household income has risen about
ten percent
uh... and during the postwar boom from nineteen forty five through nineteen
seventy three
reliable income rose about two point seven percent per year which works out
to basically during a postwar boom
real household income was riding in two years what is written over the past
forty years
sold-out sort of the story right there
just completely stop driving and state support for i read plummeted so
dissolution that that
that's what we're about where this all comes from this is
not really a new thing it's been going on for about forty years now and and i
would add that uh...
the studies that i looked at stillman
that as state colleges state universities
uh... rose their tuition rates it created upward pressure on uh... the
university systemwide
uh... and inflated the prices of our higher education across the board
because as the lowest-cost
uh... option
uh... rosen prices so did uh... the uh... the higher cost options and so
uh... it's sort of a uh... units are bhagya se
um... a perfect storm as it were in terms of making college inaccessible
and to the extent that it made it accessible it may take a
it'd limited people's options once they got there