Hi! Thank you so much for taking me last minute.
I really need this session.
No worries, I had a patient cancel so it all works out.
So there is this thing I want to talk to you about.
Have you ever noticed that every time an artist does something pervy, everyone rushes to
ask the same question?
How do we reckon with the work of someone who is accused or proven to be a predator?
If one his own movies comes up, would you have a hard time watching it?
Can you separate the art from the artist?
Should we separate the art from the artist?
Separating the art from the artist is impossible.
I’m Elisa Kreisinger.
Some people think I’m a little much.
A debbie downer.
A serious buzzkill.
But I just have strong opinions loosely held.
Sorry where was I?
Oh yeah!
My favorite films were ruined by rapists and my pop culture by predators.
Have you talked to anybody else about this?
All my friends think I’m crazy.
So I asked some strangers on the street.
Excuse me, hi.
I’m so sorry to bother you.
What's your favorite film and was it ruined by a rapist?
Um.
What’s your favorite TV show?
My favorite TV show is One Tree Hill.
Love One Tree Hill.
But I hate to tell you the show runner, Mark Schwahn has been accused by the cast and the
crew of sexual misconduct.
I’m so sorry.
But I hope you have a great train ride.
Thanks.
Hey, hi.
I’m doing this project where I’m asking people if their favorite film was ruined by
a rapist.
So what’s your favorite film?
Oh, well, uh.
It’s actually, don’t laugh at me.
It’s Clueless.
Oh my god!
Love that film.
And also no known predator.
High five.
Amazing!
Thank you!
Wow, that’s lucky!
Hi, miss, hi I’m so sorry to bother you.
Was your favorite film ruined by a rapist?
What’s your favorite film?
My favorite film is The Graduate.
Ooh, The Graduate.
I’m so sorry to tell you this, but that has Dustin Hoffman in it.
And Dustin Hoffman was accused of sexual harassment by like seven women.
Including Meryl Streep.
I know you have a text but hold on a second because Meryl Streep accused him of touching
her boob the first time they met.
Does that change how you feel about The Graduate?
Damn.
I mean can we like anything anymore?
Maybe.
What's your favorite TV show?
The Cosby Show.
I realized that we're all struggling with how our pop culture has been shaped by this
abuse of power.
Did you know that Netflix spent 39 million dollars on shows that they couldn’t release
because of the “societal reset around sexual harassment.”
As if sexual harassment prior, totally cool.
But now, it seems like every piece of entertainment requires some bizarre calculation.
Treating women like people or 30 minutes of entertainment.
I don’t know?
I really wanted to ask an expert.
So, I did. The David Carr Fellow at the New York Times, Amanda Hess.
There’s this old, kind of clichéd idea that we should always separate the art from the artist in
our critical assessment of their work.
But what I was noticing in all of these stories was that, this abuse was really specifically
tied to the work itself.
Louie C.K. is someone who was using his power and his influence to basically trap colleagues
in hotel rooms, and to take off his clothes and masturbate in front of them.
At the same time he was making TV shows and recording comedy specials, where he was referencing
exhibitionism in this way.
James Toback, the director, would bring women to his hotel room and would ask them to take
their clothes off under the auspices of auditioning them for a topless role in one of his movies.
And it was increasing clear to me that this guy was putting topless scenes in his movies so,
that he could facilitate his own personal abuse.
Hollywood is a male dominated place.
And the idea of exploiting women is kind of built in to the whole deal.
So the idea that women are only being exploited on screen, I think, was always kind of a fantasy.
So you’re saying the highly sexualized images of women are just the surface.
There’s so much more exploitation.
There's a connection, right!
As I thought about how the myth of the artistic genius excuses the abuse of power,
I couldn’t help but notice a pattern.
It was all men.
There’s Picasso, who famously abused many of the women who posed for his paintings.
Alfred Hitchcock who abused actresses so openly that you can actually see the dysfunctional
power dynamic in his work.
Roman Polanski who was convicted of drugging and rapping a 13 year old.
And yet we still think of him as a great artist?
Woody Allen, he's accused by his adoptive daughter of sexual assault.
Jeffery Tambor.
Matt Lauer.
James Franco.
R. Kelly.
Ben Affleck.
Casey Affleck.
Chris Brown.
Bill Cosby.
Charlie Rose.
I never thought I would be so happy to see so little female representation.
What is the level of artistic genius that will allow you to get away with something
as terrible as sexual misconduct?
It’s men.
And its men who have critical acclaim and financial success.
This idea that we continue to celebrate them to finance their movies, to watch their movies
keeps them in a position of power where they can offend again.
It’s also acceptable and maybe even necessary for us to take into account how something
is made in our assessment of its worth.
So how would you respond to being accused of being a Debbie Downer, a militant feminist,
a feminazi, a man hater?
I mean, I think this is fun.
I think it’s fun to think about art and what goes into it and how it reflects our
society.
That's how I get my rocks off, so.
Hmm.
Then what happened?
Talking to Amanda made me realize that the industry merges the art with the artist when
it works for them.
And when it doesn’t we say his work transcends his misdeeds.
File that under male privilege.
But how common is sexual misconduct in Hollywood.
To find out I asked actor and activist Alysia Reiner.
You know her, she plays Fig on Orange is the New Black.
I feel like sexual harassment and sexual misconduct was so prevalent, in fact, that it was the norm.
It's what was expected.
It wasn’t surprising at all.
It just was.
And I think what's magical about this moment is we hit that tipping point and this has
to change.
When you hear the excuse that, "Oh there is so much male genius leaving the industry right now."
Oh my god.
"There's so much talent leaving the industry right now."
I have nothing to say.
Except I want to throw up a little bit in my mouth.
It is my hope that together we will all create art that will be even more glorious and more
inclusive.
And that we will create a world that has more safety and equality for all.
And it’s only through awareness and deep discomfort that, that change happens.
It’s like picking a scab that was infected.
And you gotta pick that scab off, and take off the infection and put on the hydrogen
peroxide.
Which hurts like a bitch and really clean out the wound.
And let’s see if we can have a healthier scar now.
So it’s okay to feel uncomfortable right now?
I think we are all meant to feel deeply uncomfortable.
Thank you so much –
Get comfortable with the discomfort.
This just one of many cultural wounds that been festering for centuries.
I guess the only thing we can really do is keep talking about it because sunlight is
the best disinfectant.
That was good. I feel like we really got somewhere.
Same time next week?