Speaker 1: All right. Joe Rogan, Joe Rogan podcast host Joe Rogan is positive for covid, and he is
taking like seven different drugs and treatments, including ivermectin, a horse de wormer and anti
parasitic in some doses for humans. OK. All right. Well, we'll talk about that. This is notable for a
couple of different reasons. First. Actually, maybe we'll look at the video clip first.
But to set the stage, this is the same Joe Rogan on whose show I've appeared twice and I don't. But
he he may never have me back on because I've been critical of the things he said about covid and
vaccines. This is the same Joe Rogan who said, if you're healthy and you're eat right like he does,
you don't need to be vaccinated. Let's look at the video clip of Joe Rogan
explaining what happened. Listen to the list of medications and treatments that he's on.
And then there's there's much to discuss here. Speaker 4: Hello, friends. So I got back from
the road Saturday night feeling very weary. I had a headache and I just felt just run down.
And just to be cautious, I separated from my family, slept in a different part of the house.
And throughout the night I got fevers and sweats and I knew what was going on.
So I got up in the morning, got tested, and it turns out I got covid. So we immediately
through the kitchen sink, got all kinds of meds, monoclonal antibodies, ivermectin
xpac, prednisone, everything. And I also got an anti drip and a vitamin drip. And I did
that three days in a row. And so here we are on Wednesday and I feel great. I really only had one
bad day. Sunday sucked, but Monday was better. Tuesday felt better than Monday. And today I
feel good. I actually feel pretty fucking good. That's the good news. The bad news is we have to
move Friday, the Friday show in Nashville. Speaker 1: OK, so there's a bunch of stuff
that is important to talk about here. Now, again, people have been every time I talk about Joe Rogan
and vaccine stuff or whatever, people write to me. David, I thought you were friends with Joe.
I've been on Joe Show twice. We've corresponded via Twitter a few times. I would be I would say
any of this to Joe. And this is not like some hot take takedown. I'm going to tell you what I think
kind of doesn't make sense about all of this. There's the macro and there's the micro. OK,
the big picture story from from Rogen has been this is not serious enough. We're young, healthy
people should really go and get vaccinated. It doesn't make sense in in. What's interesting is
way back when I was last on with Joe, he said he did think wearing masks outdoors
made sense. Even though I was kind of saying at the time, I'm not I'm not really sure about that
more recently with Bill Burr, he said. Masks outside. Are you wearing a mask outside, sort of
like that doesn't make sense. He talked about how this is not something that is serious enough that
if you are not an at risk individual, if you're if you're healthy and eating right or whatever,
you don't really need to be vaccinated. Now, that immediately raises the question as a healthy
person who eats right and stays fit, why then did Joe Rogan need seven medications and treatments or
five or six medications and treatments, including things that aren't actually approved by the FDA,
either at all other outside of emergency use or are approved by the FDA for covid?
That is, you know that Joe Rogan's argument was no vaccine for a lot of people because
the benefits don't outweigh the risks. Covid isn't that serious? Healthy people work out, eat right.
But then you're throwing the kitchen sink at it. That doesn't really make sense.
You don't need the vaccine. If Rogen really didn't get it, I'm taking him at his word
that he didn't get it. You know, we hear about people who are secretly vaccinated. I have no
reason to believe that Joe Rogan would do that. There are some right wing hosts who
we later found out or right wing politicians. I believe Rogan hasn't gotten the vaccine,
but then you're throwing the kitchen sink at it. And it's important also to understand
we're going to go through the medications. A lot of people wouldn't have access or wouldn't
be able to afford all of this stuff either. So there were there are some people who are hearing
this and they're saying, look, Rogan was right. He had one bad day, he's not vaccinated and now he's
fine. Of course, that's to some degree chance. But also we'll talk about the Nadège drips and vitamin
drips and all these things, whether or not those things do anything, if you believe that they do
a lot of that stuff not covered by insurance and the average person can't handle that,
the vaccine is free. It's important to remember that. Now, let's go to the micro. OK, so Rogan
says he took monoclonal antibodies that is only approved via emergency use authorization. It's
available relatively widely. But remember that the Fizer vaccine is fully approved by the FDA
and and same as Moderna, which is only approved by emergency use for now, although in a couple of
weeks it will likely be fully approved. The use of monoclonal antibodies is experimental in the
same sense that they've been saying the vaccine is so no one on the list is something that's only
approved by EU. So I'm not sure why someone would hesitate on the vaccine over lack of approval, but
then go and take the monoclonal antibodies. That's a hypocrisy. I'm not saying is Rogan's hypocrisy,
but for people who are saying the antibodies are available, that's as experimental as all the
vaccine were up until 10 days ago. And now Pfizer is actually approved to a more strict level. Now,
then there's ivermectin. Ivermectin is a frequently used cattle medication. It is sometimes
used in humans as well. There's no denying that in different doses. As of a few days ago,
the big paper that a lot of people were pointing to to say ivermectin works for covid. It's based
on Egyptian data that was retracted, why they didn't have a proper placebo group
that the Egyptian paper a lot of people point to was ivermectin versus hydroxy chloroquine,
not ivermectin versus placebo, the way you're supposed to do it in a double blind, randomized
controlled trial. Then a group called the Cochrane Collaboration looked at all of the meta analyzes
of the clinical trials on ivermectin. They found that a bunch of the individual studies had
problems just like the Egyptian one. And once you look at just the studies that are done correctly,
they say there is very low to low certainty evidence that ivermectin is at all effective
on covid-19 World Health Organization, Infectious Disease, Society of America,
even the manufacturer of ivermectin, Merck, say there is no meaningful evidence for clinical
efficacy in covid-19 with ivermectin. Last week, the FDA started warning people don't
go and get ivermectin for covid-19. And now the American Medical Association is asking doctors
do not give anybody ivermectin for covid-19. So that's the second thing that Rogan is taking,
importantly, not approved even under emergency use authorization for covid, the Pfizer vaccine
is fully approved. Lastly, real quick before we move on, how did how do people start trying
ivermectin and stuff like hydroxy chloroquine? The basics are at the beginning of all this
when we didn't have a treatment, we didn't have vaccines. Doctors in different parts of the world
started trying cheap stuff that's just around hydroxy. Chloroquine has been around a really long
time and it's very cheap. Ivermectin is very, very cheap. So they start trying it. And if you have
small cohorts of 20, 30 patients and most people recover from covid anyway, you're likely to get
what is some apparent. A signal if you just have a bunch of random doctors saying here, I'm going
to give 30 of my patients ivermectin, I'm going to give 30 of my patients hydroxy chloroquine,
by chance, you might get what appears to be an efficacy signal. And you're just throwing this
stuff at it because it's cheap and available. But that's not how we actually do science. OK,
so that's ivermectin xpac. This is the antibiotic azithromycin. Now, you would say, why would you
take an antibiotic for something that's a virus? And you would be right. There are some ideas that
certain antibiotics could have an antiviral effect against some viruses. It's been studied with covid
and azithromycin. It doesn't appear to be. The case study looked at a single dose of azithromycin
and it didn't change the proportion of covid patients who were symptom free versus symptomatic
after 14 days. Now, you might say, well, David, why are they only getting one dose?
Typically, azithromycin is given as a as a course of treatment. Another study looked at intravenous
azithromycin, 10 doses over 10 days. It also didn't statistically improve outcomes. OK,
so the third thing Rogan is taking forthe prednisone, prednisone is one of many steroids.
And remember that there was the discussion of dexamethasone for covid earlier in the pandemic.
This is a very basic idea. This is the idea that steroids can mitigate the inflammatory response
and that inflammatory response can lead to lung injury in covid. So you give the steroid
it reduces the inflammatory response in the lungs. Maybe it helps people recover. Maybe
it helps people just feel better in the short run. That's generally connected to reality. If you have
inflammation, you look at using a steroid, but unless you're actually having lung compromise,
it's really not clear that it makes sense to take steroids. It can have nasty side effects.
It can actually make you worse with some respiratory viruses. In previous outbreaks
of novel coronavirus infections like Meurs, the Middle East Respiratory Syndrome, or SARS,
corticosteroid therapy sometimes actually extended how long people had the virus in their system. So
it's really unclear. And there. So that's kind of like a question mark. We don't know how involved
Rogan's lungs were. It may have made sense to try throwing a steroid at it, or maybe not. The
other stuff isn't really even medication. The NAD drip, that's nicotinamide, adenine dy nucleotide,
they it's very in vogue right now to do these dripps. There's no indication it helps with
covid. Same thing with IV vitamins. It's very popular for wealthy folks to start getting these
IV drips. I know people who do it. There's no reason to think that it helps with covid. Now,
then there's the the final thing here. If this stuff works, OK, let's just imagine
all this stuff works covid must be pretty frickin serious to throw all of this stuff
at it. And what I mean by that is if covid weren't serious, if covid were just the flu,
then you wouldn't if you were Joe Rogan, betaking monoclonal, monoclonal antibodies, ivermectin,
antibiotics, steroids, vitamins and an Nadie IV three days in a row. That's pretty serious,
right? Do you really want to take all that stuff, each with its own side effect risk if
covid isn't that serious for someone who eats right or works out or is generally healthy,
that's completely incongruous. And with the flu, you don't go and take seven medications and
treatment. So that's the real important takeaway here. I would love to talk to Rogan about this. He
may have seen my last clips about him and decided I'm not having David Pakman on anymore. He may not
even be aware of the clips. I have no idea, but I welcome the opportunity to talk to him about it.