And let's get right to the breaking news
coming out of the first hearing
before the judge in the Trump election
interference case.
CNN justice correspondent
Jessica Schneider is on the story
first Jessica.
First of all,
tell us about this newly released
protective order.
And what else happened
in today's hearing?
Yeah, well,
this was the first that we've seen
of Judge Tanya Chacon in this case.
She took charge immediately.
She did not give prosecutors
that broad protective order
that they wanted,
but she was firm with Trump and his team
that they are not to disclose
sensitive information,
including material about the grand jury
or search warrants.
So that is always part
of this protective order
that she issued just a little while ago.
And during the hearing itself,
she gave several warnings
to Trump and his team.
And she said that
she said the fact
that he is running a political campaign
currently
has to yield
to the administration of justice.
And if that means he can't say exactly
what he wants
to say in a political speech,
that is just
how it's going to have to be.
So because of that,
she said
she's going to be carefully scrutinizing
any statements from Trump and his team.
She basically said that
anything
that could be interpreted
as intimidating witnesses
or prejudicial to potential jurors,
it could really threaten
this entire judicial process
in this case as we move toward trial.
So what's under these terms
that prosecutors
are having this protective order?
Well, under the terms
they're prepared to begin
handing over material today.
And what that material includes
is 11.6 million documents.
That includes
hundreds of recordings
of witness interviews.
And it's
those recordings, part
of which Trump is prohibited
from disclosing publicly.
So, Wolf, we'll see how quickly
this case could go to trial.
The prosecution
wants it to start January 2nd.
Trump's legal
team, starting next week
will propose their start date.
It's likely that they'll propose it
after the 2024 election.
But at the rate
the judge Chuck in is moving now,
she'll likely want to
hew closer to the prosecution's
proposed January date.
But we'll see how this ultimately
moves forward to a trial Wolf.
All right, Jessica, thank you.
Jessica Schneider reporting.
Let's get some more on
all these major developments.
Our legal experts are joining us,
including George Conway and Karl Racine.
And CNN political analyst
Maggie Haberman is with us as well.
Karl, you know Judge Shulkin well.
How do you think she's going to deal
with all of this?
Well, I think she's been dealing with
this entire case
in an exceptional,
well-reasoned, balanced manner.
What you saw today was a split decision
She did not give the government
all that it wanted.
The government
actually sought to restrict the ability
of Mr.
Trump to analyze the evidence
without his lawyers.
She struck that down.
She permits
President Trump to access this evidence.
It's really important
that he of that access to the evidence
any time he wants
without a lawyer present.
Yet she's going to make sure
that witness intimidation,
obstruction of justice
or any interference
with the administration of justice
is not going to occur on her watch.
What do you think, George?
Is this a five page
protective order, as it's called,
a reasonable document?
And you think
Trump will actually abide by
what's written in this?
Well, I don't know if it's a
I don't know if he'll abide by it.
He has trouble abiding by rules
and laws, as we well know.
I mean,
if the protective order isn't shouldn't
be that big a deal,
it normally is not a big deal.
We have them in civil cases
and criminal cases
all the time when people are producing.
One side is producing
sensitive information
pretrial to the other.
So I can't imagine the judge can't
chuck and approve
something that wasn't perfectly
within the realm of possibility.
But you understand
it's understandable
that the Justice Department would seek
as much as it could, given
who the defendant is.
And it's very important to remember.
I mean, Sam Bank,
what's his name
Sam Friedman thank for the freedom was
was ordered by a judge in New York.
He's going to be ordered
to go back to jail
because he gave some materials
to The New York Times.
This is a very serious
this is very serious stuff
to violate a protective order.
And it was good that Judge Chuck
warned Trump today about that.
Yeah, it's
a very significant development to read.
And it's fascinating reading
once you read these five pages.
Indeed.
Maggie, in court today,
the judge also warned Trump to be careful
what he says
publicly about this case
on the heels of his truth social
social post saying
and I'm quoting him now,
if you go after me,
I'm coming after you all in caps.
But can Trump really contain himself?
I don't think we have
ever seen any evidence
that Trump is eager to contain himself.
There are moments,
Wolf, when his back
has been against the wall,
when he has been better than others.
But he likes testing the bounds
and seeing what he can get away with.
It would not surprise me.
And again,
we have no idea what he's going to do.
We know the things that he says
upset his lawyers.
We know that they are
frustrating to his lawyers
because they can't control him.
Donald Trump has a history
of testing the boundaries.
And so I think that you can see
a scenario
where he will continue to say
provocative things online
to see if the judge
will turn away from it.
There are other defendants
who, if they were in, you know,
similar cases.
Obviously, there is no parallel to this
with the former president,
but other people
who have been connected to January
six related cases
have not gotten as much leeway
in certain aspects as Trump has.
And so I think it is very likely
he will test the bounds
and then we'll see what the judge does
We'll see what he does indeed.
You know, Karl, Judge
Cohen
says that Trump is a criminal defendant
before he's a political candidate.
Is that true?
I think in this courtroom it is true.
What Judge Shulkin is
focused on
is making sure
that the evidence
in this case,
particularly the sensitive evidence
in this case, is
tried in the courtroom,
not on the campaign trail.
That's an important distinction.
And you better believe that the judge
is going to be quite observant of Mr.
Trump's conduct
after this protective order
has been entered to see how he behaves
and how he responds. Maggie.
I understand
you have some new reporting
that drives home
just how much Trump's
political
and legal futures are intertwined
right now.
What can you tell us about the impact
these cases are having on
the former president
Sure.
So, Wolf, my colleague Shane Goldman
and I took a look at Trump's
financial situation
and how impacted his political orbit.
That's his superPAC.
That's the campaign that Save America,
the political action committee
that's been footing his legal bills
or the bulk of them
have been strained by these trials.
Also, the fact that as a criminal defendant,
he will be required
if these trials go ahead
before Election Day
and after Election Day
would be the same thing.
But he has
he has to physically be present.
He will not be able to be
on the campaign trail for those days.
These cases are consuming
a lot of resources and a lot of time.
And he is facing a potential cash crunch.
He is facing the likely prospect
he will have to start
footing his own legal bills,
at least to some extent.
And he has said publicly
he's willing to put in whatever
campaign money
he has to
toward the actual political race.
He did do that a bit in 2016.
But commensurate with the overall amount
he spent, it was it was relatively small.
We'll see what happens here.
And do today's events suggest to you
that the judge might rule
for a very speedy trial
maybe along the lines of January 2024
the timeline proposed by the government.
Well I do think she's going to
move expeditiously.
I think the way she handled this
dispute the protective order
dispute this week
by getting the parties
in really very fast
and denying a motion to
to extend the briefing time.
I think she's going to move this case
pretty fast whether she can.
I don't know that she will
grant January 2024.
I think it's sometimes
when you're litigating
prosecutors will do this
and they will
ask for more
than they can think
that they probably will get
from the judge
and hope that the judge splits
the difference and gives them something,
you know,
not so not so bad but not pretty good.
Carl,
how do you think the judge will react,
will rule eventually on a trial date?
To be sure, no one knows.
Of course,
January 2nd seems a little early to me
given that
we're talking about $11.6 million
excuse me, 11.6 million documents
that will be
given over to the defense right now.
I think it's interesting to
look at that March date that the D.A.
Bragg has.
He's indicated recently
that he'd be open to talking
to other prosecutors
and perhaps rearranging that date.
March 24 sounds like a good date
on the January six trial to me.
All right. We shall see Guys, thank you.
Maggie, a final thoughts from you.
What should we be looking for next?
Next, we're going to see
again whether Trump, you know,
does something that the judge considers
violative of this order on social media.
We look for what
Trump says this weekend
when he's in Iowa.
We look at the next debate
and whether the first debate
and whether Trump actually goes.
But this is, Wolf,
we've never seen anything like this.
This is a series of legal actions
with wrapped around a political campaign.
This is not a normal political season.
Trump obviously is using this campaign
as something of a shield.
We've been talking about that long
before he actually got in the race.
It's part of why he got in the race
as early as he did
and also to freeze the field.
But we should be looking for
everything that he says
about these cases.
Any change in language,
any way that he handles it differently.
And again, what the
judges in the cases do.