>>> THE PROBLEM WITH MAIL-IN
VOTING, YOU’RE NEVER GOING TO
KNOW WHEN THE ELECTION IS OVER.
WE’RE GOING TO HAVE AN ELECTION
THAT TAKES PLACE ON A BEAUTIFUL
DAY, NOVEMBER 3rd.
USUALLY AT THE END OF THE
EVENING, THEY SAY DONALD TRUMP
HAS WON THE ELECTION.
DONALD TRUMP IS YOUR NEW
PRESIDENT.
WHATEVER THEY SAY, YOU KNOW
WHAT, YOU’RE NOT GOING TO KNOW
THIS, POSSIBLY IF YOU REALLY DID
IT RIGHT, FOR MONTHS OR FOR
YEARS BECAUSE THESE BALLOTS ARE
ALL GOING TO BE LOST, THEY’RE
GOING TO BE GONE.
>> IF YOU WERE A PAID AGENT OF A
FOREIGN COUNTRY, HE COULD BE --
HE COULD NOT BE MORE EFFECTIVE
AND UNDERMINING THE INSTITUTIONS
OF AMERICAN DEMOCRACY.
AND IN AN OP-ED FOR "THE
WASHINGTON POST" TITLED TRUMP IS
ACTIVELY WORKING TO UNDERMINE
THE POSTAL SERVICE AND EVERY
MAJOR U.S. INSTITUTION, RETIRED
NAVY ADMIRAL WILLIAM McCRAVEN,
FORMER COMMANDER OF SPECIAL U.S.
OPERATION COMMAND, THE ONES WHO
HUNTED DOWN AND KILLED BIN LADEN
RIGHTS IN PART THIS, TODAY WE
STRUGGLE WITH SOCIAL UPHEAVAL,
SOARING DEBT, RECORD
UNEMPLOYMENT, A RUNAWAY PANDEMIC
AND RISING THREATS FROM CHINA
AND RUSSIA.
PRESIDENT TRUMP IS ACTIVELY
WORKING TO UNDERMINE EVERY MAJOR
INSTITUTION IN THIS COUNTRY.
HE HAS PLANTED THE SEEDS OF
DOUBT IN THE MINDS OF MANY
AMERICANS THAT OUR INSTITUTIONS
AREN’T FUNCTIONING PROPERLY.
AND IF THE PRESIDENT DOESN’T
TRUST THE INTELLIGENCE
COMMUNITY, LAW ENFORCEMENT, THE
PRESS, THE MILITARY, THE SUPREME
COURT, THE MEDICAL
PROFESSIONALS, ELECTED OFFICIALS
AND THE POSTAL WORKERS, THEN WHY
SHOULD WE?
AND IF AMERICANS STOP BELIEVING
IN THE SYSTEM OF INSTITUTIONS,
THEN WHAT IS LEFT BUT CHAOS, AND
WHO CAN BRING ORDER OUT OF
CHAOS?
ONLY TRUMP.
IT IS THE THEME OF EVERY
AUTOCRAT WHO EVER SEIZED POWER
OR TRIED TO HOLD ONTO IT.
LET’S BRING IN RIGHT NOW STAFF
WRITERS FOR THE ATLANTIC
MAGAZINE, DAVID FRUM AND ANNE
APPLEBAUM.
ANNE’S LATEST BOOK IS "TWILIGHT
OF DEMOCRACY," AND ALSO WITH US,
COLUMNIST FOR WASHINGTON POST,
GEORGE WILL.
ANNE, AS YOU WRITE ABOUT IT IN
YOUR BOOK, THERE WAS A TIME NOT
SO LONG AGO WE WOULD BE
CONSIDERED RIGHT OF CENTER
CONSERVATIVES, YOU KNOW,
ECONOMIC CONSERVATIVES WHO
BELIEVED IN LIBERAL --
TRADITIONALLY LIBERAL VIEWS OF
THE ECONOMY, OF FREE TRADE, OF
SMALLER GOVERNMENT, AND, OF
COURSE, I THINK MOST OF US WERE
DEFINED BY THE COLD WAR AND OUR
BELIEF IN THE SUPERIORITY OF OUR
SYSTEM OVER THE OLD SOVIET
SYSTEM.
BUT YOU SAW WHAT WILLIAM M
McCRAVEN SAID TODAY, AND
SUDDENLY THE WORD CONSERVATIVE
NOT ONLY IN THIS COUNTRY, BUT AS
YOU DESCRIBE IN COUNTRIES ACROSS
THE GLOBE, IS FAR DIFFERENT THAN
WHAT IT WAS A FEW YEARS AGO.
>> YES, THAT’S CORRECT.
LOOK, THE CONSERVATIVE MOVEMENT
AS IT WAS IN THE 1980s OR 1990s
WAS REALLY A COALITION AND IT
WAS HELD TOGETHER BY DISLIKE OF
THE SOVIET UNION, BY
ANTI-COMMUNISM, BUT ACTUALLY
PEOPLE WHO WERE MEMBERS OF IT
WERE MOTIVATED BY MANY DIFFERENT
THINGS.
SOME WERE FREE MARKETEERS, SOME WERE CHRISTIANS, SOME WERE IN
WERE CHRISTIANS, SOME WERE IN
FAVOR -- THEY OPPOSED THE SOVIET
GEOPOLITICS.
WHEN THE COLD WAR BROKE UP, IT
SOOK SOME TIME, BUT THAT
COALITION BROKE UP, TOO.
MANY MEMBERS FOUND IN THE POST
COLD WAR ERA THEY DIDN’T HAVE
MUCH IN COMMON WITH THEM
ANYMORE.
WHAT WE’RE SEEING IN A LOT OF
COUNTRIES IS THE BREAKUP OF WHAT
THEY CALL CONSERVATIVE MOVEMENT
INTO DIFFERENT GROUPS.
VERY OFTEN INTO A RADICAL, YOU
KNOW, OFTEN AUTHORITARIAN OR
ANTI-DEMOCRATIC GROUP AND OTHERS
WHO SEE THEMSELVES AS STILL PART
OF -- STILL PART OF A DEMOCRATIC
MAINSTREAM WHO BELIEVE IN
CONSERVATIVE IDEAS ABOUT
ECONOMICS AND ABOUT HOW
GOVERNMENTS SHOULD RUN.
>> GEORGE WILL, I GREW UP
READING YOUR COLUMNS, READING
YOUR BOOKS AS A CONSERVATIVE.
AND I KNOW YOU FIND YOURSELF AND
DAVID FINDS HIMSELF IN THE SAME
POSITION ANNE WRITES ABOUT
REGARDING FRIENDS THAT SHE’S HAD
FOR DECADES THAT NO LONGER
CONSIDER THEMSELVES FRIENDS
BECAUSE OF POLITICS.
AND SHE SAID, WE FOUND OURSELVES
ON OPPOSITE SIDES OF A PROFOUND
DIVIDE, ONE THAT RUNS THROUGH
NOT ONLY WHAT USED TO BE THE
POLISH RIGHT, THE SPANISH RIGHT,
AND SOME BRITISH RIGHT AND THE
AMERICAN RIGHT, TOO.
THIS IS NOT JUST ABOUT DONALD
TRUMP, IS IT?
>> NO, IT’S NOT.
WHAT MAKES ANNE’S BOOK SUCH A
BRACING READ IS THIS.
ANNE IS A TRANSATLANTIC FIGURE.
SHE’S MOVED FROM POLAND TO
LONDON TO WASHINGTON.
SHE KNOWS THE CONSERVATIVE
MOVEMENT AND ITS MANY
MANIFESTATIONS.
WHAT SHE IS WRITING ABOUT AND
WHAT I THINK WE’RE EXPERIENCING
TODAY IS THE EUROPEANIZATION OF
AMERICAN CONSERVATIVISM.
EUROPEAN CONSERVATIVISM HAS A
HISTORY OF THROWN AN ALTAR,
BLOOD AND TRIBALISM.
AMERICAN CONSERVATIVISM QUITE
DIFFERENT, WELCOME THE
INDIVIDUALISM AND AMERICAN
CAPITALISM.
DONALD TRUMP SETTING OUT TO MAKE
AMERICA GREAT AGAIN SET OUT TO
MAKE AMERICA MORE EUROPEAN IN
THE SENSE IT HAS INJECTED THIS
TRIBALISM AND MADE IT NORMAL IN
OUR POLITICS.
THIS IS COINCIDED WITH THE FACT
THAT A LOT OF AMERICAN
CONSERVATIVES ARE SHOCKED
BECAUSE THEY ARE CHRISTIANS AND
THE SOCIETY IS INCREASINGLY
SECULAR.
THIRD, AMERICAN CONSERVATIVES
HAVE BOUGHT INTO THE CONSULT OF
VICHLIZATION.
THEY LIKE TO FEEL THEY ARE PUT
UPON BY ACADEMICS, HOLLYWOOD,
THE MEDIA AND ALL THE REST AND