s
citizen pleasure welcome back to the program
distinguished ga
allred middlebury
all agenda of one of thousands of three fifty dot org he is on b_ do the math
tor
right now bill they can and bill thanks so much for
url joining us
when we wake you know
so now bill if you had mentioned to us uh... we caught up with you i guess it
was over the summer maybe was that uh... net roots nation
that uh... fall
on the election uh...
you're
b
uh... rolling out the uh... a new initiative and a
i guess it was do the math
and so tell us about this uh... tell us about the store
well so we got on the road uh... every night
since election the night after the election we started in seattle
uh... we've now
needed on the west coast and down the east coast now are heading across the
country or in chicago today
uh... we've done except for couple dikkat thanksgiving big shows every
night maple almond sold out its two and three thousand sheet venues so it's a
it's a different kind of thing when the environmental movement but in the past
but we're finding it to be a great
organizing tool
it's all about taking on the plus a fuel industry directly
and uh... one of the tools were using news
divestment
ten weeks this about a hundred and fourteen l college campuses did it
kicked off that thats the campaigns in the last few weeks as we've done this
tour so it's really
you know that note to the rogue show itself is exciting and lots of fun but
that uh... keep part is that it's translating into organizing and passed
so tell us about what
um what what is the day uh... divestment uh... involve a
nina and trying to get
blanket colleges universities churches pension plans to sell their stock
attempted fossil fuel companies
uh... the curious to know that the map that i laid out for all of this in
rolling stone in the summer and the basis of this tour
simply demonstrates how it be responsible
these guys have become american aruba for scapegoats five times more carbon in
there
declared reserves
and even the most uh...
conservative government thinks would be safe to burn so you know put the tobacco
industry was to individual human beings uh... fossil fuel industry it's too
planet oak which we only have
you know one that we can inhabit
so it uh... it and that's what we're get mad and in fact we actually had
what way ahead of schedule
we first college that announced it was the best and all its funds from fossil
fuels that just a few days ago
unity college in maine their board of trustees voted a few days later the
student body of her reverted three-to-one to demand that uh... that
our word
uh... trustees do the same thing
so the fight is not that's fantastic and what's the woods and tell me what
how does this representation if t in
the the thinking um... about how to
organized and get active in terms of of global warming because it seems to go
uh... giddy explain the explain it in
are going to we're going to much more after
fossil fuels
industry
then we have in the past
alm
that's the problem
or were hard at work trying to get
demonstrate sont tarnished not talk much
worrying about their parking paid for politicians at the moment although we're
continuing to work hard on
expect to keep some pipeline
the real task right now
and it's just that
change the basic dynamic your we think that the fossil fuel industry
well planned the political power that it translates into histories and we've had
so little luck
uh... for so long
in getting anything in washington and a lot of other capitals
he and i think uh... chris hayes in many ways uh...
the weekend that you were on board
uh... but i'm not sure exactly when he said it but he he described it damn that
uh... climate change is an issue that
we haven't seen
since really slavery as an institution at least in the context of this country
where there was so much financial resources and so much uh...
financial interests at stake in in uh... in changing our perspective on this
yes i mean it's obviously not a perfect analogy shins slavery was a much what we
are more important moral thanks
but there's also the catalyst
parallel
uh...
you know people are saying there's no possible way we could run our economic
system without you know
uh... and in fact work
finding out that that's not true
but would but the good news from this
very bad year a year the teen record plugged in the city
drought everything else but good news is
uh... coming from dramatic but one that country that's taken serious like any
other stuff
and we are just beginning to show more than two getting astonishing results
from their renewables program their word paper this summer when germany produce
more than half the power used from solar panels within its borders
uh... uh... uh... identified milkman given for germany's work it out on a map
but to find out what we need is not
uh... sunlight gets political will
and uh...
hopefully we can start to support predicting getting hatched
the political power of the fossil fuel industry first
uh... i was gonna ask you about that because we actually uh...
tahan doses a day uh... the gray davidson on the program
uh... terrific book kisiel
that all their order reassess really told u_s_ and its it's it's encouraging
because on some in some respects
it seems to be the first
um...
throw had i had a really describe it but it seems to be the first serve the hot
mystic argument
um... in terms of our capacity to deal with this problem
and
you know but my question to him in my in my question to you to ease
you know what what have you seen in terms of across this country because it
seems to me that localizing degeneration of the power
or up our through the sort of distributed i threw it disturb you did
uh... system
um... is something that they can't sort of thing
happen in parallel to
as we have the existence of this sort of fossil fuel
uh... centralized based system
well i think he didn't want to know if that's true the problem respect
as long as pops a pill doesn't pay anything for the damage that carbon does
in the atmosphere
you're always going to have this tremendous
cost advantage
using dirty energy it's critically
so it's quite to prague fight we got to be doing
locally
you know this is for you know most of my writing them
group years now it's been about the need for
local economies will call energy all of that
we have to be doing that but at the same time we have to be working
globally and nationally changed the ground rules so that this can happen
that just happened to that it can happen pastor dr really matter if that's the
problem
or up against the clock now
do you think that there's any way for us to to overcome the climate crisis
and
uh... continue sort of our lifestyle keep driving
what i think it not been giving secretariat
since all of the stuff we
trip we can keep going after things that we can i'd you know i i don't see any
way that
allows the kind of analyst continued growth of of
uh...
get aircraft travel around the world perhaps
that's okay because you get over the last five years
we've learned to do we're going to drop a lot of our travelling by rail shuttle
absorb labor
internet is doing so what
ten a_m_ yesterday dot
and we're gonna have to more that so we can have expressed interest
take the american this huge american machine
talks at the internal combustion engines but you know when no one carry-on
precisely as before
but uh... you know the world that we're building a london-based beat sweeter the
boeing or every alan
are more
democratic once it's
hugo energy sources come from close to home
uh... one of the other things i was talking about was the uh... so we also
have the opportunity to talk to uh... to for last evening's so much a sickness is
now
uh... explained across the country in a different showing little bolts
snippets of it every night on this road show trying to get people to go to it
it's an amazing phil
and people
gotta go see it at st comes together
and we just played actually it is too short
video i guess that was shoot shot of a woman coming out of the movie basically
uh... talk that she said i would listen to bill o'reilly every period and now i
would not believe the global warming to error that was powerful testimony
talk to us about what the the concept of feedback loop is because i'm not seen
you know uh...
uh... the u_n_ i guess it is now talking about uh...
you know monna ring the the permafrost which apparently is not so parma anymore
uh... boy yesterday showing per project helping at a faster rate and we had
good news at all
um... another big study today showing key level writing about sixty percent
faster then we had thought uh... also had not good news
uh... look once you are keep the planning to assert on it
odd things begin to start happening out there on the court of were clearly
getting near those points
uh... which is why it's
shall imperative that week
you know stop talking about what we're going to do in twenty fifty
and start taking curious action right
that is that is that the feedback loop i mean when uh... when you start to
the d processes the damage that we're doing two
uh... the environment started feeding and created more damage
exactly right orenthal you know we have our name on the purpose tab for the
moment but if we raise the temperature high enough
say permafrost has not been a large quantities and nothing has been released
into the atmosphere
we don't have any way of
dialling that doubt weakened alabama
she had to buy
you know changing our cars and
factory thanks
but we don't have any way of recreating the permafrost
and
carlson i wanted to talk to them one of the things uh...
there was a story out today uh...
the edison's today and slay talking about uh...
you know that
to a certain extent
under the old bomb administration between uh... the uh... the stimulus
the american recovery act and other initiatives that there is there seems to
be a little bit more
or attention being paid to of fish in c
when you do that in the context of the greater argument about energy
independence
um...
why do we see
this sort of the argument of energy d independence being
sir as discussed
almost as if it's a separate context from
climate change
you know as well it's always discussed our leadership the relevent exp
it
to finish this family politics you know and i think sometimes hip-hop
ministrations really fall into it
absolving that kind of a lingering problems of the twentieth century
instead of focusing on many immersion problems of the twenty first st enough
image energy independence they have so many people talked about for fifty years
so status billy import
oil replace whatever
well that that may have been
the worst problem we had
uh... with loyal
twenty five years ago
but it doesn't even come close to the problem but armitage presents now
uh should be much better to start talking about
independence from fossil fuel
uh... yeah
clearly germany can do it
i mean germany wax
arizona new mexico california and nevada florida texas
uh... you know munich sort of montreal
uh... i don't know what works
monkeying around with
and and we're on the uh... eve of the uh... still hot climate change talks
give me a sense of are there other countries i mean obviously uh... germany
is one which is addressing this
in incredibly aggressive fashion
are there other countries out there
that
or are leading this charge
argentine what what what are the dynamics at least in terms of on an
international level
um...
who are the players that we should be looking to that are pushing this
and who were the ones that are dragging their fellow
that's a pretty sure for a short list i mean it's really short if u
if you say ordered the nun scandinavian countries better
uh... engaged in this
um... what nobody's covering themselves with glory everybody's waiting for the
u_s_ and china to act
uh... u_s_ and china cute
uh... say now wait for you you know you first no you her step trio
uh... it's just turned into a sort of mcleod
you know how we didn't uh... i didn't get going
father going through this
throw out thing this year at all
special rate at this point
until we break power fossil fuel industry and up to
open up some real possibilities
and and and what is that meaning
what does that look like in the breaking the power of the fossa few industries it
is all right you know there was a time but i want to go on
philip morris was a perfectly respectable companies you know the way
that it's not it's for that
uh... uh... we got to get to the point
uh... there
so you know that the biggest financial players and our election campaigns
where that comes with the cost is well it's benefit the people
is there any attempts uh...
attack i guess this industry
in the same way that the tobacco industry was attacked in terms of of
some type of civil actions paralegal actually discuss t_v_ the mother of all
poor kiddo graduate it almost every problem or what your critics so good
accurate
it's hard to find a coordinator up
unclear or if you go to when your country it's just disappeared beneath
the way it cannot
um... there are people doing good work going this way some weeks were waiting
for some
breakthroughs hopefully
but i got a player right now are court system is not really in the hands of
uh...
people in quite a whisper carefully regarding that
and and let me ask you this in this uh...
was also question from the audience but i mean it's it's one that i've asked you
before but
um... how do you
both personally
and i think you know as a
uh... as one of the
the nation's served leading activists on this front uh...
continue to stay positive uh... because of him
with it well
it's just you know that there's a lot of people willing to fight that bangor
maine we've began reception of this
people go to match that three fifty toward action updated e-ticket flesh
anyplace further i'm coming to us that they can at least get a chance
where it is that uh... you know but uh... interest we watched this kind of
spreading excitement will have a videotape concert did you all of this
that our friend rush park is putting together a little bit outbreak january
as a kind of organizing tool two people be able to see it and i'll see the kind
of energy that there is a pall over the country
for taking action on a scale commensurate with the problem that's
pathetic
and answer what is the uh... what follows this amino way biased in that
you guys have
serve does sound and send some fascia so there's a lot of pentium ended up sick
subtlety perfect
ali arc than that though i think it will be running these big divestment
campaigns is many places that we can also he saw always fair
salacious large pennell beach toddlers
shareholder
uh... meeting do you know civil disobedience that kinda stuff going on
hopefully building up no kind of summer of action
but we also of course kept a very quickly take its moral quiet so director
p dot org workshop undead ninety-one countries
since we're ding for u_n_ processes broken working meaning hale
uh... or system
or more crime or more power shift this summit it
six or seven young people for every country on earth interest on board jim
the kind of trying to shame them into doing what they should be doing a lot
are there um... i mean are there particular countries that might be
we're the
it easy to use your to attack
the uh...
uh... the fossil fuel industries in other words they have less some
interesting possibility
here on your way to current resting country burry progress report so big
state-owned oil industry about
will see how it goes
interesting because i would imagine in you know the
getting out the place where the the the sort of power is he you know less
concentrated
this country it seems as been dominated by will interest for
seventy five years in some respect
barry dishes
they were the most attracted country on earth so it's no wonder it artist nut to
crack
uh...
but there's a lot of art nuts to crack and frankly i mean sort of
probably new rather be working period and try to do the same thing in russia
right now right indeed
are well bill i really appreciate i know your uh... your you're obviously
literally running onto orrin hatch and senator cup your arms such a pleasure to
talk to you
stamp thank you get that always for your good work