- When we had McNabb on here, I didn't know 15 years later that you guys had not reconciled.
- Nah, I've tried. He's phony.
I tried to be cordial with the situation. I thought we had squashed it, but then you guys did an interview,
and then all this resurfaces again.
♪♪♪
- So who we got in the pool hall today?
Finally, T.O.!
- What's happenin'?
- What's good with you, man?
- I'm good, bro
- How you livin'?
- Just like everybody else during this pandemic. Slow right now.
- [Laughing]
- I gotta ask you man:
How nice are you on the pool table?
Cuz the Untold Stories audience has been waiting for you to jump on the pool table.
- Well, you know, I ain't really come here to play no pool, but you know.
- Don't worry, the audience is getting their popcorn ready too.
OK.
- So I gotta to ask you,
Untold Stories' audience has been waiting for you to jump on this show.
- Right.
-After the Donovan McNabb episode, what was your reaction when you saw that episode?
- I mean, just listening to some of the comments and statements about
I "pretty much ruined the opportunity to run it back."
Leading up to the Super Bowl,
all the questions within the media,
they were geared around, was I gonna make it back?
For him to be, really, the quarterback, the face of the franchise,
I felt like he could've answered those questions.
I guess for whatever reason, the statement of
he didn't need me to win the Super Bowl or play in the Super Bowl,
I felt that was a slight for whatever reason.
And then I saw the interview—
- Like, it's unbelievable. But, you know, that was somethin' that
kinda broke us up.
That was the most frustrating for me because I knew
what we could do
and if we decided to just come together,
what we'd be able to accomplish.
- He said that I ruined their chances, so for me, it was contradictory.
To say that you didn't need me to play in the Super Bowl
and win it,
but then I prevented you guys from running it back.
So you didn't need me then, so why would you need me to run it back?
For me, I felt like it was bush league to me, to be honest.
- You out here playin' bumper pool.
- The '04 season. We heard McNabb's perspective in terms of how he felt that season played out.
I wanna hear your perspective.
How'd you feel the '04 season started?
- When I went over to the Philadelphia Eagles, I had
nothing but the utmost respect for that organization.
And for me to come over and add to the fire power that they already had with Donovan at the quarterback position—
in San Francisco, I didn't have a quarterback that could step back, you know, throw the ball
80, 90 yards down the field.
We had that in Donovan. I knew that going over there.
- 70-yard drop in the bucket, right?
- Yeah, I mean 81 yards, right on the jersey number.
- 81 yards, yeah. - Right on the jersey number.
- So '04 season started smooth, then?
- Oh, man, it started out with a banger.
Going throughout the course of the season, there was no problems.
There were no problems.
The city of Philadelphia embraced me.
Where I was at the height of my career at that time,
I felt like I was unstoppable.
I knew what I brought to the table.
Everything was going according to plan, and then late December,
we're playing the Cowboys and that's when—
- I'm a Cowboys fan, man. So that play, I can never forget that play, man.
- Man, yeah, that play there, I mean, it changed a lot of things for
really kinda the rest of the season for us and, you know, for the league.
That play by Roy Williams, it got deemed as the horse collar rule.
- So how long were they talking about you supposed to be out for?
- With that type of injury for any normal person,
they're done for the rest of the season.
I took that as a challenge, and I was like, "OK, cool.
Let's get with it."
And I vowed at that time, I said, "If our team plays these playoffs and they win—"
- I remember that. - I said,
"I'll be ready for the Super Bowl.
I'll be ready." That’s what I—and I truly believed that.
- How'd you perform? How'd you feel you did?
- I didn't do bad, you know, considering—
- What were the stats again?
- Nine for 122. Nine for 122.
- What happened against the Patriots?
- When you're a quarterback or any other position,
do what got you there. You know, try not to do too much.
I was tryna be perfect.
And so some of the balls that—which I threw, obviously—ended up bein’ intercepted.
In turnovers versus New England,
it's tough because they always come back and capitalize.
- There were some things that were said and known after the fact about, you know, Donovan's play, things of that nature.
- Like what?
- I mean, they said he threw up in the huddle.
- I need you to set the record straight.
- I did not throw up in the game.
- You did not throw up in the game?
- I did not throw up in the game.
- Where did this come from?
- You know what, that’s a great question.
As I say every time people bring it up,
roll the videotape.
You know, the film don’t lie.
- Why would somebody lie?
There were teammates that said he threw up in the huddle.
Personally, I didn't see it,
but there are guys, and I know that there are
teammates that I've talked to recently
that said that they saw him throw up in the huddle.
I've talked to teammates since then
and know for a fact that he was out the night before.
- He was out the night before?
- Yeah, he was out the night before,
before the biggest game pretty much of all of our careers.
There's people that saw him out the night before,
said he was drinking, and I think that attributed to him throwing up in the huddle.
He's obviously had a history of condition problems.
So, for me, you know, knowing all this information, I felt like that was irresponsible,
especially for somebody of his caliber, his status, to obviously be the leader of the team,
and you're out the night before the biggest game of your career. You're out drinking or what have you,
and then that maybe contributed to him throwing up in the huddle.
It’s just not good.
- Come on, scratch.
-Yeah.
- At this point, are you guys still cool?
- Yeah. - Like, when did things turn
sour between you and McNabb?
- At this point, like, I had no problems with McNabb.
I think things turned sour the next year.
Obviously there were some contract negotiations, some situations surrounding me.
Andy Reid and I, we had some disagreements.
He sent me home for the day.
He basically just told me to keep myself in shape, you know?
He'll get back in touch with me when he feels like we're ready to resume or whatever.
- Then all of a sudden, there’s turmoil here and there are conversations going back and forth.
And we had to answer those questions instead of focusing on what we need to do in order to get back to where we were.
- What ends up coming out of that?
- So, I go home.
I drive home. By the time I get home, obviously it's breaking news.
It's basically hit the media wire that I'd been sent home or what have you.
And I’m in the house maybe 20, 30 minutes,
and next thing you know, I hear a knock at the door. I look through the blinds,
and media trucks are camped in my front yard.
- What was going on in your mind?
that's not a normal experience for anybody. Even an athlete,
like, that's not a normal experience for an athlete to have. - Nah, it wasn't normal for me.
Like I said, it was very unexpected.
I just didn't understand what the hoopla was, I guess, surrounding me.
I learned to embrace it, and I think that moment was
me learning and trying to embrace the media. So that's why I came out there with the ab bench and doin’ the situps and things of that nature.
Because I tried to make light of the situation.
I took it to heart that
Andy Reid said, he told me to stay in shape while I was away. So, I—
- You just took it literally.
- Yeah, literally. I did. I took it that way.
- I thought that was the major distraction for us.
You know, he’s doin’ situps. You know, he’s doin’ pushups. He’s playin’ basketball. He’s ordering pizza for the people out there.
And we sittin’ there in training camp just like, “You gotta be kiddin’ me!”
- Honestly, if you look in that clip, I got an earpiece in my ear.
I had my publicist on the line,
and she's hearing everything that's going on. And so she's hearing the questions, and she's basically telling me what to say.
So, but I mean, it was just me having fun with that moment.
- We in our dorm rooms
and, you know, I’m just sittin’ there and I’m watchin’ on TV.
And Brian Dawkins and Trotter were my roommates.
And Dawkins come in. He’s like, “Man, what he do now?”
I'm like, "Take a look."
- [Laughing]
- Like, this is like Days— - Roll the footage.
-This is like Days of our Lives.
- Looking back on that, do you wish you could've handled that differently or, like—?
- Uh-uh. I mean, if it happened today, I would probably do the same thing.
You know what I mean?
I may have added some popcorn and some little bit of everything at this point in time.
Like, I really would've made it really a show.
Speaking of popcorn, can I get some popcorn?
- I got you. I hope y'all got y’all popcorn ready
for this one too. - Yeah, yeah, yeah,
you got to have your popcorn ready at all given times. - Gotta have the popcorn.
Yeah, no doubt.
- At that time, that was between me and Andy Reid. It was a disagreement.
He sent me home.
What I do at my house is my business.
I don't worry about what you doin’ in your house.
- And this point too,
so you're going through the contract situation.
You mentioned earlier about McNabb.
What was his involvement in terms of your contract situation? What'd you hope that he would do?
- Donovan, he was an advocate for Brian Westbrook getting his money.
When it came to me, he wasn't as vocal.
You don't talk about another man's pocket, you know what I mean? You don't talk about another man's money.
But at the end of the day, he took the liberty to talk about and be an advocate for Brian's contract.
But then when it came to me, it was the polar opposite.
So that's why I knew things had kinda changed.
- Why do you think that was?
- I don't know. You should've asked him.
For whatever reason, I guess it ate at him that people said that I made him a better quarterback.
Those are questions that the media had asked him,
and he snapped back at ‘em.
Be complimentary.
- There you go. At that point, is that when the fallout is just so evident?
- Yeah, I mean, think from that point, even from the Super Bowl with him answering the questions of,
he didn't need me to win the Super Bowl.
- When we had McNabb on here, I didn't know 15 years later that you guys
had not reconciled.
- Nah, I've tried.
I tried to be cordial
with the situation. I thought we had squashed it, but then you guys did an interview
last year or whenever it was, some months ago.
And then all this resurfaces again.
- Are you and T.O. on talkin’ terms, or what’s the relationship like now?
- Hey, I give a nice peace sign and keep it movin’.
You know, I’ve—you know, I respect his time. You know, I love my time.
You know, and, and there's no need for me
to try to dust off anything that happened in the past cuz what was in the past is in the past.
You know, he's made a few comments, you know, as of late.
That's cool with me.
Listen, I’m a grown man. I handle grown-man business.
- Will it ever be a point of reconciliation, you think? It’s been 15 years, 20 years.
- I've heard him say he's moved on.
He puts up the deuces.
Bro, at the end of the day, he don't make me, man.
Like I said, I'm in the Hall of Fame
for what I've done and what I've accomplished.
I appreciate the opportunity to have played with him,
but at the end of the day, like I said, check my stats before I got there
and check my stats when I left.
He's supposed to be the great quarterback or one of the top quarterbacks in the league in his mind.
You can't go to Washington and not beat out Rex Grossman.
- You think he belongs in the Hall of Fame?
- I could care less.
- [Laughing]
At the end of the day, I'm worried about me. I could care less about that.
- [Laughing]
- Whoo!
I tried to— - Put alot of heat on that one.
- Yeah, I tried to bring some sauce with that thing.