DHARNA NOOR: Welcome to the Real News Network. I'm Dharna Noor joining you from Baltimore.
[Music]
NOOR: That was Joe Hill, or The Ballad of Joe Hill, written by Alfred Hayes and performed
by Paul Robeson. On November 19, 1915, 100 years ago today, Joe Hill was executed by
the state of Ohio for a crime he did not commit: the murder of a grocer and his son. Joe Hill,
also known as Joseph Hillstrom to some, was a Swedish-American labor activist and organizer
with the IWW, or the Industrial Workers of the World. He was also a songsmith who wrote
about the issues faced by working people.
Here to discuss Joe Hill and his legacy is Alexis Buss. Alexis served six terms as the
general secretary treasurer of the Industrial Workers of the World, and she also worked
as a union organizer specializing in direct action strategies. She compiled the centenary
edition of Haymarket Books' The Letters of Joe Hill. Thank you so much for joining us
today, Alexis.
ALEXIS BUSS: Thanks, Dharna. Thanks for having us on.
NOOR: So Alexis, most historians agree that Joe was framed. There was even an appeal to
then-Utah governor from the president then, Woodrow Wilson. How did they come to this
conclusion? Why is it so obvious that he was framed, and why was he executed if he didn't
commit this crime?
BUSS: Sure. Well, let me take your second part first. Joe Hill was executed because
he was a union organizer. He was a known member of the Industrial Workers of the World. That
union, which was highly effective at organizing the most low-income, vulnerable workers, was
despised by the copper bosses and the politicians of Utah. And it was a frameup in retaliation
for his organizing. Police actually arrested the likely person who committed the crime
that Joe Hill was executed for, and let him go. And that guy was a career criminal. He
later went on to be part of Al Capone's mob. He looked similar to Joe Hill, but Joe Hill
suffered the consequences in what's widely regarded, even at that time, as a frameup
trial.
NOOR: I think one of the most striking things about this compilation, this book, is the
ability to see how involved Joe still was from prison. I mean, he's locked up for a
year and he's still writing letters to his comrades, and still writing protest songs,
documenting methods of protests and theories. Were there any attempts to silence him while
he was in prison?
BUSS: I think more Joe probably self-censored. He did not write about sensitive matters,
but moreover Joe probably had a misplaced faith in the system, that he only came to
realize was misplaced a little too late into it. So at his hearing he represented--at his
preliminary hearing he represented himself. It was only late in the game when he'd already
been sentenced to death that he got outside legal help, accepted it from the union, that
he implored not to spend too much money on his case. He really wanted them to continue
organizing and doing what they could for workers such as himself, and keep up the organizing.
It's not clear that the authorities censored his words while he was in jail. And he wrote
four songs, some of his best-known songs, while he was incarcerated. And the union was
able to get them out and disseminate them.
NOOR: And another really cool thing about what's shown in these writings in the book
is how much Joe fought for not only labor rights, but for gender inclusivity. He's declaring
his admiration for the Wobbly Elizabeth Gurley Flynn, and talking about how women workers
are the most oppressed. And then there are the songs about fighting racism, about police
brutality. Do you think that Joe Hill was ahead of his time?
BUSS: I think he was part of an organization that was pioneering, in a lot of ways. But
I don't like to use the words ahead of its time. It was--it tried a lot of great stuff.
And I don't think that it was marching to the beat of its own drum or anything. It was
right--what working people needed. And let's not forget, this IWW was doing multiracial
organizing, including women. And not just including women, putting women organizers
at the front of its organization. At the turn of the last century. This is at at time when
Woodrow Wilson was showing Birth of a Nation, the KKK propaganda movie, in the White House
and inviting people to see it.
So I think what we can learn, 100 years out, is that there are always voices saying let's
have more democracy and more equality, and more justice. And we have to tune into those
voices and hear where they are, and amplify them. So it's not that everyone was wrongheaded
100 years ago. It's that the IWW and Joe Hill histories come to show that they were right.
And that what was going on in the presidency was wrong, and what was going on in the prevailing
culture was wrong.
NOOR: And what do you think that Joe would think today, if he could see the state of
America and the state of the labor movement, of the left, of the working class?
BUSS: I think Joe Hill would be very excited to see there's still a lot of fight in the
working class and the workers of this country, and I think he'd be just as disappointed as
many workers with the state of labor rights. When Joe Hill was doing his organizing, unions
were considered a conspiracy by the law. Now we have union--a rate of unionization that
is just slightly higher than when Joe Hill was doing his organization, was doing his
organizing. And the methods that Joe Hill and his union advocated are still just as
relevant. So when you can't rely on the law to protect and advance your rights, you take
direct action, and you work with your fellow workers not just on the job, but in your communities.
And you organize to uplift everyone.
NOOR: Sometimes when we speak about these really seminal folk artists, and specifically
within the labor movement, there's this tendency I think amongst people to say this is a lost
art, that we've lost the art of the protest song. Do you think that we have Joe Hills
today, these truly radical musician organizers?
BUSS: Yeah. Well, I--absolutely. I think there are a lot of musicians that kick ass for the
working class. For the book that we're releasing, with Joe Hill's letters, Tom Morello wrote
an excellent forward. He is holding the flag of working class labor anthems high. I had
the pleasure of attending a concert that he organized with Joan Baez, who took up the
mantle from Paul Robeson and popularized The Ballad of Joe Hill at Woodstock. It was a
pleasure to have Boots Riley from The Coup there. He's another working class voice that
speaks truth to power, and yeah, I think we have a lot of great examples today.
NOOR: So clearly in the death of Joe Hill we still have much to preserve. Thank you
so much today for coming on and joining us to talk about this, Alexis.
BUSS: Thank you.
NOOR: And thank you for joining us on the Real News Network.