social media.
>> Yeah, a preview of when line
of attack for sure.
Kristen Holmes, thank you very
much.
Let's get some perspective on
this.
Joining us now is Michael
singleton, a Republican
strategist, and Molly John fast,
a special correspondent for
vanity fair and host of the
fast politics podcast.
Sure Michael, let me start with
you.
This has been a Maga
lollapalooza this weekend at
CPAC.
We were showing some images of
trump won hats and that sort of
thing on tables.
And you look at the recent
polls.
He's really out in front in
almost every poll of the
Republican field.
I know it's very early.
But he won the CPAC straw poll.
Is there anything really
standing in the way right now
of this point of don trump
securing the Republican
nomination at this point?
>> I think one thing to be
concerned about, Jim --
and thanks for having me --
is potential litigation against
the former president.
Look at Georgia.
A potential indictment come?
I think the jury is still out
on that.
I also think that trump
presents an interesting
dichotomy for the Republican
party, which is why you are
seeing Ron Desantis move up in
the polls with many Republican
voters.
And that, is if Donald Trump is
the nominee of the Republican
party, can he actually win, Jim?
--
can he pull over, persuade
voters, move them in
positioning with suburbanites?
That doesn't appear to be the
case if you look at the last
presidential and it does not
appear to be the case if you
look at the most recent midterm
election.
That is a concern that many in
the party, including donors,
including other strategists,
and even those working with
some of the folks who are not
trump supporters saying, we
want to win, and yes, we like
trump, but is he the best
person to help us get across
that finish line?
>> Yet, there's a huge
disconnect right now between
the donor base and the Maga
base.
>> Molly jong-fast, it seems
trump's positioning his
presidential run as kind of a
revenge tour.
I think we have some sound from
trump's speech.
I think this is one that is
going to be making a lot of
headlines.
Let's listen.
>> In 2016, I declared I am
your voice.
Today, I aim to clear, I am
your lawyer, I am your justice.
And for those who have been
wronged and betrayed, I am your
retribution.
I am your retribution.
>> I am your retribution.
He said it twice, Molly
jong-fast.
>> Look, this guy is out for
blood.
And I think the problem with
all of these more normal
calculus is about Ron Desantis
is that trump is not a normal
candidate.
So, trump will not do what mark
aruba did or Ted Cruz did and
go quietly.
So, I think that, for a lot of
these Republicans who think
they can swap him out, I am not
sure how that works when you
have someone who really is
comfortable running as a third
party candidate or just
destroying the party on his way
out.
I mean, remember, trump is not
a Republican per se.
He is whatever that is.
And I don't think his heart is
with the Republican party.
And I do not believe he will
support whoever is the
candidate.
>> And shermichael singleton,
what do you make of the state
of CPAC?
Is it the same conference that
used to be?
I remember covering it six or
seven years ago.
And it just strikes me as a
very different organization.
Mike pence, not there.
Ron Desantis, not there.
It's a different CPAC now.
Trump has a lot of people in
that room right now.
But some of the speeches
earlier on in the conference
had me thinking whether CPAC
should be held at the holiday
inn in crystal city.
>> Jim, it's evidently a
different CPAC then it was when
I used to go years and years
ago.
>> The sort of intellectual-ism
that, once upon a time, to find
a Republican party because of
individuals like Karl rove,
intellectually speaking, or --
minions of what it will --
national review, which lowery
--
those guys really are not
activists and participants in
the modern-day Republican
party.
So, there's this question --
right, Jim?
--
of what is it mean to be a
conservative over the next four
years.
Who is going to be the
individual or individuals to
take that mantle in the charge
of defining what conservative
policies and positions would be
as far as legislation goes.
And I don't think the party has
quite figured that out.
CPAC has had many symptoms CPAC
version.
Florida, many other states
across the country, for two
years now --
and if you look at the crowd,
it is a very low.
It's a different crowd.
And I think that's indicative
of the fact that many in the
party are trying to figure out,
where do we go after trump?
Do we stick with him?
Or is it time to move on.
And as a strategist --
and you are looking at the
numbers --
I would probably say, Jim, that
it is time to move in a new
direction where the party risks
a repeat of trump versus Biden
in 2024.
Mp.
>> Right, 2018, 2020, 2022.
It's not exactly a winning
streak.
Molly, one thing we also
noticed this week was Nikki
Haley, trump's former U.S.
Ambassador to the when --
she had sort of chilly
reception at times.
Mike Pompeo, he was talking
about the former presidents
veiled references.
Let's listen to that.
Nikki>> We have lost the popular
vote in the last seven out of
eight presidential elections.
Our cause is right.
But we have failed to win the
confidence of a majority of
Americans.
That ends now.
>> Losing is bad because losing
is bad.
But the principles that we
stand for our what really is at
risk.
And it's not a political
problem.
The problem is that the losses
are a symptom of something much
bigger.
I think it's a crisis in
conservatism.
We have lost confidence that we
are right.
It's not just a crisis of
confidence.
It's one of character as well.
>> Molly, this is almost what
shermichael we're seeing a few
moments ago.
The message for some of these
candidates is that they want to
move on from trump they don't
want to say his name in any of
the speeches.
It's almost like beetle juice.
They don't want to say because
use too many times.
What is going on there with
some of these candidates like
Nikki Haley and Mike Pompeo are
just sort of tiptoeing around
trump?
>> I think that they could
quietly lull away the base by
sort of tricking them into not
saying anything mean about
trump but offering them sort of
trumpism light as a kind of
possible bait and switch.
And I think that, ultimately,
this stems from this idea that
they will not take the pain.
They want the fringe.
They want those votes because
trump won in 2016 by never
alienating alienating the
fringe.
And that fringe is really very
fringy.
That's the white nationalists
and the autocrats and really
they're just the sort of drags.
And those were the people we
are, for such a long time,
Republicans rejected those
people.
And trump knows that is a good
amount of people.
And that's how he won.
I mean, it's a good quantity of
people, not good people.
So, I do think, ultimately,
they are trying to get those
people without getting those
people and without alienating
them.
And I think, ultimately,
someone is going to have to say,
like, we don't embrace this
kind of racism.
And they are going to have to
take the pain.
And then, eventually, rebuild
the party.
>> Shermichael singleton, what
do you think about that?
Can you take on trump without
really confronting him by name
or confronting him in general?
What would you advise as a
Republican strategist?
>> I mean, look.
You have to.
You clearly would risk not
being a competitive individual
not running for the Republican
nominee --
for nomination, I should say --
but you have to.
Pompeo is right where he argues
or made the statement about
conservatism.
I think the problem I have --
and I don't want to get
philosophical here.
But the party has really become
a sort of nationalist populist
party.
And I think there is room
within the American populist
generally speaking for
conservatism in the traditional
and classical sense.
But I think that's far removed.
When you look at many of the
struggles out of more diverse
country is presently dealing
with and facing, what is the
conservative answer, Jim?
To many of those questions,
what's the conservative answer
to police reform?
The conservative answer to
education?
The conservative answer to
infrastructure or climate
change?
Those things no longer
intellectually exist the way
they once did in the past.
And so I think that's the
problem that the Republican
party is having in its
inability to target and we
should Americans beyond its
base.
That's what is going to be
necessary mathematically in
order for the party to be
competitive in federal
elections.
>> And Molly, lastly, is Donald
Trump Joe Biden superpower?
>> It's certainly possible.
He's certainly Democrats's
superpower.
I think you are going to have a
hard time getting out of that
primary without either trump
winning it or trump destroying