>> All right so Russia is not known as a press friendly
government and judging by the way the Kremlin has responded
since this war began that reputation is not likely to
improve today, Russia confirmed that it had blocked access to
facebook and earlier this week the country's last independent
TV station was shuttered by state authorities on Wednesday
TV rain streamed one final broadcast showing the remaining
staff walking off set.
And a video of the ballet swan Lake.
>> This Bali broadcast was in reference to the fall of the
Soviet Union when the same ballet was shown on Lou on TV
during the attempted coup of Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev
after receiving threats, the former editor-in-chief of TV
rain was forced to flee for his safety. I spoke with him last
night.
>> 2 days ago the the to my colleagues we started to see
past threats. Tax, so said the best that you see the social
media. This is something which have been at it for the bowl.
The years when you are full number is published somewhere.
And usually you that's a lot of attention to it because it's
some part of you know information war, I would say
it's but now the service consensus Pete is complete to
differ. It's in this atmosphere, you start too.
Some seem to different about it. So yeah, I I consider these
tax pretty serious.
>> In addition to silencing TV rain. The Kremlin has blocked
multiple for news organizations. Websites and
just today, Russia's Parliament passed a harsh new censorship
law that could lead to prison time for journalists for years,
the Kremlin has tried to keep an iron grip on the information
Russian citizens have access to invasion in Ukraine is clearly
tightened that grip joining me now is in us all the Washington
bureau chief of Dutch avella German newspaper which recently
shuttered its Moscow offices. It's thank you so much for
joining us. I know last night TV rains editor in chief.
I told me about the threats he and his colleagues face from
the Kremlin can you tell us a little bit about your own
experiences as a journalist, fielding threats from within
Russia.
>> Right, I mean you know we had a barrel of the Moscow
goals scored TV broadcasters so they keep those low to the
clothes we had to close an hour. Barrow right before to
thought that in its invasion in 2. Ukraine this tells you how
this is everything is kind of organize but him and that is
all a colleague to spend in your interview yesterday night.
This is really an information war, what is going on and did
so it's getting worse by the day as we just for the new law
allowed though is John the bill and abroad free ends the true
information they might face up to 15 years in jail that's a
long time in a Russian jail.
>> There was this perception that Russia over the years
after communism was opening up we saw it take a turn towards
some sort of capitalism all the brands all the stores,
everything was opening up people felt that they were
consuming at least Western culture, but it seems that's a
far cry from the reality when it came to critical information
and news and journalism how has it changed is this a dramatic
escalation or has Russia been building to this point for
years, you think.
>> That's a very good question and it has dramatically changed
some of you always face, read you know, I was the evidence
even though it's different for some years and I visit the de
la studio very often we also expect cooperated the Dodge
than other. Independent TV station in Russia which got
shut down. They will always facing Fred we were facing
but this definitely has been getting worse over the last
Fred,
months and now that the state really a new low, you know,
I've seen and Russia.
Quite often it's really close. I was based in Berlin for a
couple a couple of years that don't like it. Well as flight
that was another that the beautiful countries opening
out, but I mean the Russians. Many of them consider
themselves also being Europeans so it is really devastating
from a European from a German perspective to see what is
going on and 2 or 3 years and it came to be quite honest as a
surprise no one will stick. I think team to really start to
devastating war within Ukraine but also a kind of rolling time
back within his own country which indeed has opened in so
many ways.
>> I want to tap into your expertise as I can somebody who
probably tracks European media and certainly German media much
more than I do and I try to keep an eye on some of the
English language press in Europe, including Germany and
the UK and France. But how would you compare how Europe is
covering this to how America's covering it, I mean we have we
have right wing news in this country that sometimes borders
on propaganda if you will certainly when you consider the
talking points but what is the media landscape like in Europe
when it comes to covering this conflict are people in the
press in Europe saying this is not our fight we should not be
involved or how are they debating issues like the
refugee crisis there.
>> Well, you know we have we have a very different much more
emotional approach to the war why because you know we've been
living and the Cold War or to the to a cool off. But the
cause fear the Russian you might hit a when Kiev well when
the invasion started the Ukraine I talked to my father,
he was 0.38 and he said, when you heard says the sirens he
but whose bombs on his bank because this brought all the
memories he had as an only child. During the Second World
War so this whole conflict, this whole war it's much more.
Emotional in Germany and and then throughout your about
these people when it comes to being by is though not by is.
I was also covering. The Trump election year in the United
And I think it is getting harder and harder here in the
country and it's free pantry no the United States to really get
on by his nation and they see that also agree
go out and report and talk to people in if their opinion on
political decisions being made here. They belong Robert is
that that I don't do that but I think the American media.
I'm much more kind of eager to take a political stand. We do
that in Germany and Europe heading that said yeah the
media landscape is changing, I think all over the world.
So there's the should but my impression here is in the
United States that do have brother right rather liberal or
right wing leading media more than the common Germany.
>> No I greatly appreciate that and I have one last question
might try to squeeze in here and we have about 30 seconds
left, but there's been some talk whether or not Germany is
going to reconstitute its military in the wake of what
has happened. Can you tell us really quickly about the debate
within Germany is Germany going to reconstitute a military and
take a more aggressive security posture and we have about 15
seconds, I'm sorry.
>> Yeah, I know it's it's yes we really change el Pollo think
that put out much we will put out Michael spend much more
money and money on all in that area have been so this is a
major should.
In the German defense policy.
>> All right is Paul. Thank you so much, I appreciate your time
I look forward to having this conversation with you as this
continues to play out.