CLAIMING THAT THE FRAUD WAS
NATIONALLY COORDINATING AS HAIR
DYE RAN DOWN HIS FACE.
THE PRESIDENT AND HIS CRONIES
TRYING TO STEAL AN ELECTION IS
WHERE WE START THIS HOUR.
JOHN HEILMAN IS BACK, AND
EXECUTIVE EDITOR OF THE RECOUNT
AND THE POST OF THE HELL AND
HIGH WATER PODCAST.
ALSO JOINING US JASON JOHNSON,
POLITICS AND PROFESSOR AT MORGAN
STATE UNIVERSITY AND MSNBC AND
AGREO CONTRIBUTOR.
AND ANDREW WEISSMANN, MSNBC
LEGAL ANALYST.
I WANT TO START WITH YOU.
IS THIS A THING?
I MEAN, WE KNOW THEY’RE NOT
COMPETENT TO EXECUTE IT, BUT
WERE THEY, IS THIS POSSIBLE?
>> I THINK PRACTICALLY SPEAKING
IT IS NOT POSSIBLE.
FIRST, WITH RESPECT TO WHAT
THEIR DOING IN THE COURTS, IT IS
REALLY NOT A LEGAL STRATEGY.
IT IS A POLITICAL STRATEGY.
THE COURT CASES ARE ALL BEING
THROWN OUT OR BEING WITHDRAWN.
IT IS ONE OF THE GUARDRAILS THAT
IS ACTUALLY STILL FUNCTIONING.
AND, YOU KNOW, IN THE COURTS YOU
NEED FACTS AND YOU NEED THE LAW.
AND THEY HAVE NEITHER.
SO YOU’RE SEEING ALL OF THAT
BEING THROWN OUT WHICH IS WHY I
THINK YOU’RE SEEING PLAN B.
WHICH IS TO GO DIRECTLY TO THE
LEGISLATURES.
BUT THERE IS A PROBLEM HERE.
WHICH IS THAT IF THEY’RE NOT
CAREFUL, WHAT THEY’RE DOING
COULD VIOLATE BOTH FEDERAL AND
STATE LAW.
WHICH IS YOU COULD NOT TAMPER
WITH BALLOT ELECTION RESULTS.
AND THIS IS A PLACE WHERE THEY
MAY BE HOISTED BY THEIR OWN PER
TARD BECAUSE THE ATTORNEY
GENERAL ISSUED A MEMO SAYING
THAT WE’RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO
GO IN AND FIX THINGS NOW, THE
NORMAL PROCESS WAS TO WAIT UNTIL
THE ELECTION IS OVER.
WELL, WHERE IS THE ATTORNEY
GENERAL NOW FOR PEOPLE WHO ARE
GOING IN LIKE LINDSEY GRAHAM AND
OTHERS WHO ARE GOING TO BE
TRYING TO TAMPER WITH OFFICIALS.
SO THIS IS WHERE THEY HAVE TO
WORRY.
BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY ATTORNEY
GENERAL BARR IS NOT GOING TO DO
THAT.
BUT THERE IS SOON GOING TO BE A
CHANGE IN ADMINISTRATION.
SO THEIR REPRESENTATIONS WILL
COME WITH WHAT THEY DO IN THE
VERY STATES, IT IS GOING TO BE
QUITE RISKY.
>> I MEAN, IT IS SUCH A SAD
COMMENTARY THAT YOU EVEN HAVE TO
UTTER OBVIOUSLY BARR WON’T DO
THAT.
I MEAN, ARE YOU SAYING, THOUGH,
THAT THERE ARE POSSIBLE
VIOLATIONS OF THE LAW IN LINDSEY
GRAHAM’S CALLS TO THE GEORGIA
SECRETARY OF STATE AND OTHER
EFFORTS TO INTIMIDATE OR
OTHERWISE INFLUENCE WHAT
ELECTORS DO?
>> ABSOLUTELY.
OBVIOUSLY THE FACTS MATTER.
IT IS IMPORTANT TO KNOW EXACTLY
WHAT HAPPENED IN THAT
CONVERSATION.
BUT THERE ARE FEDERAL LAWS THAT
PROHIBIT FALSELY CERTIFYING AN
ELECTION OR TAMPERING WITH AN
ELECTION.
AND THERE ARE STATE LAWS.
SO YOU HAVE BOTH THE FUTURE
ATTORNEY GENERAL AND YOU HAVE
LOCAL ATTORNEYS GENERAL WHO
COULD BE LOOKING AT THIS ISSUE.
AND SO IF RUDY GIULIANI AND
SYDNEY POWELL AND OTHERS ARE
GOING TO BE TRYING TO STRONG ARM
PEOPLE, THOSE KINDS OF
REPRESENTATIONS ARE NOT JUST
HOLDING A PRESS CONFERENCE,
WHERE THERE IS NO -- THEY DON’T
HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT LEGALITY,
THEY COULD SAY WHATEVER THEY
WANT, BUT IF THEY’RE GOING TO
TAKE THIS INTO DISCUSSIONS TO
TRY TO GET PEOPLE TO CERTIFY
FALSELY ELECTION RESULTS, TO GET
TO CHANGE THE WILL OF THE
PEOPLE, THEY REALLY DO HAVE TO
WORRY ABOUT CROSSING A LEGAL
LINE.
AND AS I SAID, THIS IS AN AREA
WHERE THE COURTS ARE GUARDRAIL
THAT IS ACTUALLY HOLDING UP.
AND FRANKLY, WE’RE SEEING THAT
EVEN WITH REPUBLICAN STATE
OFFICIALS WHO ARE NOT WILLING TO
BREAK THE LAW AND ARE GOING TO
UPHOLD DEMOCRACY.
BUT NICOLLE, AS YOU SAID, IT IS
SUCH A SAD STATE THAT WE’RE EVEN
HAVING THIS DISCUSSION.
BECAUSE JUST A SHORT TIME AGO,
THIS WOULD BE UNMANAGEABLE TO BE