>>> JOINING US NOW, THE NUMBER TWO RANKED DEMOCRAT IN THE
SENATE MINORITY WIPE DICK DURBIN
OF ILLINOIS.
OF ILLINOIS. GOOD TO HAVE YOU ON THE SET
HERE.
HERE. ON THE SET HERE
MUST BE VISITING THE GRANDKIDS. >> EXACTLY RIGHT.
>> WHAT DID YOU MAKE OF THE
INTERVIEW?
INTERVIEW? I KNOW YOU WERE LISTENING.
WHAT STOOD OUT TO YOU?
>> I LISTENED CAREFULLY BECAUSE
YOU ASKED QUESTIONS MANY OF US
WANTED ANSWERED FOR A WHILE.
I WANTED TO GET INTO THIS "WALL
STREET JOURNAL" INVESTIGATION
USED TO DISCREDIT McCABE.
I HAVE TO SAY, I’M STILL
STRUGGLING WITH THE FACT AFTER
TWO DECADES WORKING IN THE FBI,
TAKING A CLOSE LOOK AT THE
QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS AND MAKING
LIFE AND DEATH DECISIONS, THAT
HIS EXPLANATION DOESN’T REALLY
SATISFY ME AS TO WHY HE FALTERED
IN THIS MOMENT WHEN HE WAS BEING
ASKED ABOUT HIS OWN CONDUCT.
>> WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF THE
INVESTIGATION LINDSEY GRAHAM NOW
WANTS TO LAUNCH AN
INVESTIGATION?
INVESTIGATION? >> IT’S INTERESTING.
I’M THE ONE WHO BELIEVES THE
SENATE JUDICIARY KNEECOMMITTEE H
BEEN ON THE SIDELINES OF THE
CONTROVERSY.
CONTROVERSY. THIS USED TO BE THE PREMIERE
COMMITTEE THAT LED THE
INVESTIGATIONS ON THE MOST
CONTROVERSIAL ISSUES OF THE DAY.
THE LAST SEVERAL YEARS WE’VE
BEEN AWOL.
BEEN AWOL. I HAVE BEEN MAKING THAT POINT IN
THE COMMITTEE AND THOUGHT WITH
LINDSEY COMING IN, HE WAS AN
EXCEPTION IN THE CRIMES
SUBCOMMITTEE AND CALLED PRETTY
IMPORTANT HEARING.
IMPORTANT HEARING. HE HAS AN OPPORTUNITY IF HE
WISHES TO OPEN THE DOOR OF THE
JUDICIARY SUBCOMMITTEE.
JUDICIARY SUBCOMMITTEE. I’M WONDERING IF HE’S OPEN TO
THAT DOOR.
THAT DOOR. >> HE HAS ONE OF THE MOST
IMPORTANT POSITIONS OF THE
UNITED STATES SENATE, CHAIRMAN
OF THE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE, THE
TIP OF THE SPEAR FOR DONALD
TRUMP DECLARING AN
UNCONSTITUTIONAL EMERGENCY.
UNCONSTITUTIONAL EMERGENCY. >> THAT’S THE PROBLEM, JOE,
BECAUSE WHEN HE OPENS THE DOOR
WITH ANDREW McCABE THERE ARE
QUESTIONS HE AND OTHERS WILL
RAISE WITH OTHER WITNESSES.
LET’S NOT STOP HERE.
LET’S GET THE STILL STORY BEFORE
US.
US. DOES THAT MEAN HE WILL CALL THE
GANG OF EIGHT?
ANYONE WHO PARTICIPATED IN THE
INTELLIGENCE BRIEFING THAT
OCCURRED.
OCCURRED. >> WAS THAT A SHOCK TO YOU
ANDREW McCABE NOTIFIED MITCH
McCONNELL, DEVIN NUNES, CHAIRMAN
BURR, PAUL RYAN, HOW QUICKLY WE
FORGET, PAUL RYAN, AND LET THEM
KNOW THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED
STATES WAS UNDER INVESTIGATION
FOR POSSIBLY NEFARIOUS TIES TO
RUSSIA AND NOT ONE OF THEM
RAISED AN OBJECTION?
>> LET ME PUT IT IN CONTEXT.
I HAVEN’T BEEN A MEMBER OF THE
GANG OF EIGHT BUT IN SOME
BRIEFINGS IN MY CAPACITY OF THE
APPROPRIATIONS COMMITTEE.
APPROPRIATIONS COMMITTEE. IT IS RARE IF EVER YOU HAVE THAT
KIND OF CONFRONTATION YOU SAY,
THAT’S NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS,
OVERSTEPPING, YOU’RE INTO
SOMETHING YOU’RE NOT LEGALLY
ENTITLED TO DO.
RARE.
RARE. YOU TRY TO ABSORB THE
INFORMATION AND THINK, THIS IS A
THIN SLICE OF REALITY, I WANT TO
ABSORB IT AND PUT IT IN CONTEXT
WITH MY STAFF.
>> WOULDN’T YOU PICK UP THE
PHONE AND SAY, TELL ME MORE.
>> I WOULD BE SURPRISED IF
SOMEBODY IN THE PRESIDENT’S
PARTY DIDN’T REACH OUT TO THE
ADMINISTRATION TO LET THEM KNOW
WHAT HAPPENS.
WHAT HAPPENS. >> WHAT ABOUT THE CENTER OF THE
25 AMENDMENT, AS SERIOUS AS IT
GETS, IMPEACHMENT BY A NAME OR
VOTE IN THE HOUSE.
DO YOU THINK THAT’S APPROPRIATE
THE DULY ELECTED PRESIDENT WOULD
BE REMOVED UNDER THE 25th
AMENDMENT AS TO INCAPACITATION.
>> YOU PUT YOUR FINGER ON IT.
THAT IS THE STARTING POINT.
IS THIS A QUESTION OF INCAPACITY
OR DISABILITY?
OR DISABILITY? NO.
NO. FROM WHAT I HEARD FROM MR.
McCABE, A QUESTION WHETHER MR.
TRUMP HAD BEEN COMPROMISED WITH
HIS RELATIONSHIP WITH THE
RUSSIANS.
RUSSIANS. YOU THINK, REALLY, MIKE PENCE
WILL START THIS PROCESS AND GET
A MAJORITY OF THE TRUMP PROCESS
TO SIGN ON.
I DIDN’T KNOW HOW FIT THAT WAS.
IT SEEMED LIKE A REACH WAY
BEYOND --
BEYOND -- >> IT’S AN INTERESTING
CONVERSATION TO HAVE AS YOU LOOK
WHETHER HE’S COMPROMISED.
A LOT OF PEOPLE WOULD LOOK AT
THE FACTS RIGHT NOW AND WONDER
IF HE’S COMPROMISED.
>> I THINK THAT’S A LEGITIMATE
LINE OF INQUIRY BUT DOESN’T FIT
IN McCABE’S BOOK.
I THINK HE WAS WORKING ON THIS
COUNTER-INTELLIGENCE ANGLE AND
WHETHER HE WAS TO BE BROUGHT UP
IN OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE BY THE
FBI.
FBI. >> IT WAS PASSED REALLY QUICKLY.
NOBODY ACTED ON IT.
THE ONLY REAL NEWS WAS ROD
ROSENSTEIN OFFERED TO WEAR A
WIRE.
WIRE. >> EVEN THEN, I THOUGHT McCABE
WAS PLAYING DOWN SLIGHTLY AS HE
SEEMED TO BE SAYING HE SUGGESTED
THAT AS WELL AS OTHER THINGS.
THE WIRE SIDE OF IT, HE
DEFINITELY SAID HE WASN’T
JOKING.
JOKING. I WAS STRUCK BY THE DEGREE OF
CHAOS AND EMOTION IN THE ROOM
AND SAID HE COULD BARELY FOLLOW
A CHAOS AS ROSENSTEIN WAS
WALKING BACK AND FORWARD.
>> AND OUR INTELLIGENCE
COMMITTEE APPEARED TO BE SHAKEN.
>> ONE OF THE THINGS McCABE SAID
AT THE END OF THAT, HE HOPES THE
PERSON THAT GETS TO THE BOTTOM
OF THAT IS MUELLER, WHETHER THE
PRESIDENT EVER WAS AN ASSET, IS
STILL AN ASSET.
HOW CONFIDENT ARE YOU AFTER THE
CONFIRMATION OF THE NEW ATTORNEY
GENERAL WE WILL SEE THAT REPORT?
>> YOU REALLY PUT YOUR FINGER ON
THE WHOLE BILL BARR NOMINATION
AND WHY I VOTED AGAINST IT.
I RESPECT HIM AS AN ATTORNEY AND
MAN A FORMER ATTORNEY GENERAL.
I SAID TO HIM AT THE HEARING, MY
FIRST QUESTION IS, WHY DO YOU
WANT THIS JOB?
WHY ARE YOU WALKING INTO THIS
DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE AT THIS
MOMENT IN HISTORY WITH THIS
PRESIDENT?
PRESIDENT? I LISTENED TO HIM AT THE HEARING
AND AFTERWARDS HE HAS AN
CONSTITUTIONAL OBLIGATION, HE
FEELS IT.
FEELS IT. TWO THINGS WORRY ME, FIRST, THIS
VOLUNTARY 19 PAGE MEMO TO THE
TRUMP DEFENSE TEAM SAYING UNDER
THE UNITARY PRESIDENTIAL THEORY
THE PRESIDENT SHOULD BE SCARED
FROM CERTAIN INVESTIGATIONS AND
ACTIVITIES AND CRIMES.
SECOND, THE WHOLE QUESTION
WHETHER HE WILL DISCLOSE THIS TO
THE AMERICAN PEOPLE,
TRANSPARENCY OF THIS REPORT.
I THINK WIDE TRANSPARENCY AND
RELEASE OF IT IS CRITICAL FOR
THIS NATION TO COME TO GRIPS
WHAT WE FACED FOR TWO YEARS.
>> DO YOU THINK WE’LL GET TO IT?
>> HE’S TRYING TO PROTECT
SOWRNGSZ METHODS.
SOWRNGSZ METHODS. I DO BELIEVE THE MORE RELEASED
IS BETTER FOR THIS NATION.