it's see and i think that this is a really this is the kind of
crucial point to highlight because our viously china
you know china and russia of course have terrible records uh... when it comes to
human rights freedom of speech
and everything else that's been used against noted even though obviously he's
an incredibly precarious invulnerable position
uh... to be a pretty clear eight now being stranded in a moscow airport but
so much of the intention being focused on ecuador which despite its problems
and
can be a place of legitimate criticism clearly has the best record by far of
those three places
and yet
most of the effort that we've seen from a communications and p_r_ perspective
has been targeted ecuador
uh... so it uh... it event obviously highlights reflects what you're saying
now that said
president career seems like he's sort of step back
uh... from
what appear to be several days ago like uh... you know plug
relatively high likelihood that uh... ecuador would offer
or are snowed in asylum and christan a couple of interesting things over the
past couple days he simultaneously
unilaterally canceled preferential trade status with the united states which is
what
the sort of big economic character of the u_s_ was holding over ecuador
so he did that
and then at the same time he is at least rhetorically walked back and uh... the
notion of giving
uh... snowed in asylum and said that it's going to be
a long process fine he's not sure about it and he appreciated dot his his phone
calls vice president by the so how do you kind of read the signals that korea
sending now
uh...
i am not
really
and expert honor
i_d_ internal politics in ecuador or ecuador south american relations with
the u_s_
it's pretty clear
clear that up
do you think they do you expect that that the extractor here to vienna
staunch
and that i thought you prepare that u
manage uh... snowed in and and it's and and there may be a power struggle
between korea and the star strength
uh... experts but there's also a brothel technicalities
about how to get
uh... snowed in out of moscow
um...
correct that korea had arranged for temporary travel document but it's
really difficult
to get him through without
a path for the u_s_ is a vote that's at his passport and i don't know what
astonished has tried to do
third there've been reports of a kind of power struggle
during the two
do those things that those ecuadorian documents had andy at any deal
you know a lot affect on
ecuador is that decision on started and also
do you think those are do you know if those documents handy effect on what
ecuadorian stink about a career
acting out these
that this story had much of an effect in ecuador although the interior minister
but they said i want to ask
uh... answer for them
um... at a press conference and he
issued a pretty defensive response but he said that ecuador doesn't
you know conduct last five minutes of the cincinnati
he's uh...
but it does surveillance cousteau this kind of a quicker response the u_s_ keys
but by the heated sold these uh...
this story has you know kind of expose about a program that was on the state
level at the n_s_a_ in the u_s_
and yet they've
freely they've
have been forced to admit that piece
um...
that this equipment
described a document
uh... may have never been used
by ecuador intelligence services so really would be the distinction between
if it was leaked that the n_s_a_ in the u_s_ intelligence apparatus was
considering prism
purses actually implementing something and yet this was sort of leveled
as being equally raju decided our report for mondo ait on some of the equipment
uh... using uh... monitor american also lekha ache hain he had a routing
fiberoptic
transmission student c_n_n_ say listening centers and they were using
israeli equipment they're using a machine called an arson site which is
one of the most advanced
uh... pieces of surveillance equipment and i don't don't see any evidence pet
uh...
the equipment
described by but he can't do anything like the marriage insight abner
you know that something like off half a million dollars could be used right on
that that's a very high on sagale yeah i mean what what korea's worker is doing
is much more crude which is using criminal libel law against people who
are all
publicly opposed to a man i think that bad enough
i he doesn't really need to combat
spying to crack down
on his opponents uh...
and any other info out to american politics and we saw it
out opposition media was used in venezuela this is an heroes some game
east each opponents
island and right wing antagonist are not
using democratic means themselves off
they are
openly calling for a clue and i remember our there is an attempt to after nine
eleven
and that's when our position media sustained attempt that went on for years
pooling
chavis
to al-qaeda under opposition median in ecuador is trying to
desperately to link uh... ecuador to iran
ambassador
until it not is not it's not emanates like
fox news on steroids
and then
uh... orders like just
foxnews all the time within
and then i you have a model right coming up in
underwriting
it's singled out for an for engaging in covert propaganda activities on behalf
of the contras indeed lecturing at government on how
are not you know it's it's democratic use of the media and i'm free speech in
a free press attempted to joke yeah exactly yan on the right to me to be
really clear that this is someone who and
you know he was given
a really hard time by people like former senator chris dodd you know this was not
this is a very
it was very universally understood that this guy was an incredibly toxic in
noxious force in latin america
as well as the united states an act and cannot be kind of but you know
reaffirmed enough i want to get back in the final part of our talk to
tobias feed
um... and what's interesting you know
i don't know ben smith road uh... appease a couple of weeks ago actually
defending
snowed in uh... as a source find criticizing journalist sort of piling on
him unevenly greenwald
profile they published was a much more
it was more subtle
than the new york day
the news piece there and i think that you know so it's so that so that's the
kind of interesting
space that buzzfeed occupies because you probably uncertain if you ask you know
i think ruth rosie dc gray has actually been on the show before orion arena fire
maybe i don't know if you she's been interviewed by sam before
on you know on some good sort of
you know liberal investigative journalism against the coke brothers of
somebody like that
so what do you think do you think that there's my system use that you think
there's a really specific
danger uh... in bus feeds risk receptivity
uh... to all of this kind of covert p_r_ material precisely because they actually
do you do
some you know
is leaving side all the entertainment obviously but they do do some good
journalism they do have a kind of a liberal reputation and yet there are a
conduit offered the types of forces you're talking about
expected record important point
i don't really think
i don't know about them they're coming up at some
suspicions about him bob by the uh... robot arm
really see ruthie gray necessarily as a hard-core ideologue
and as i said before about the it should have a p_r_ laundromat basically what
these reporters what backpacker journalist for everything with michael
hastings was not perioperative michael hastings and i thought it was
ironic that ben smith windup eulogize in europe
i mean what michael and i think that that the other thing
uh...
factor journal if they want access and we're good way to get act that's been
d_c_ is to making connections with lobbyists
who are always
chopping story from back of their clients who often foreign governments
and there who are and and maintain apartment
people who are operative for the powerful people on bench mythic and
threatened credibly network there
on with the new york onto the washington
he's accepted lobbying favorite the bath uh... the government of georgia i mean
actually not entre b_o_j_ farah documents
along with people like you i like
and he's very it's a really pathetic defenses that themself
competent through the firm called our ryan strategy is run by michael goldfarb
with a hard right wing likud mc neo con
uh... lobbyist who also um... one the freebie ten which is the right wing
magazine advises the american people ready for israel despite group that was
attacking chuck able as a parent
loving molly coddling anti-semites
and so i think i will bend committed accepted papers from this lobbying group
in bought out dinner uh...
you know dinner sponsored by the republic of georgia
and then you know possibly run story that the government of georgia fat them
uh...
he has diabetes promoted emergency committee for israel propaganda by
covering it you know under the guise of journalists are not saying that he was
doing it because you naturally agreed with that it's just
you have a conference
betty stream of stories
they're pushing you
they're pushing your career forward
and people are reading them
and there were a great seem to be relevant i don't know why anyone would
get publicity to a group like the emergency committee for israel
but when you're in access journalist
it's really a question of cool can who can climb you
who can supply you with
the most stories
and usually though if the most aggressive p_r_ operation in d_c_ with
the most corporate body
uh... u_p_i_ funded by adults emit a ton of money and they can in that kind of
thing and so they that they were a lot of people like ben commitment would be
great here we have another example of that
some people just came to them instead
we got documents for you if your defendant
story will give you the leaked documents this exclusive it's an incredible story
of ecuador and if you can if you have access to a lesser amoral and you
probably don't really
have very strongly about
beliefs one way or another and for that let q be applied by the right wing i can
tell you um... that since my story came out to other journalists are
have told me that
they will keep you know almost every week if not every day from a republican
operatives
i'm i'd never heard of before
online ecuador and at this republican operative as an admin account which don
ecuadorian
opposition
group and is bombarding journalist every week feeding them what stories that you
don't cheat
that happening from the other side to this is really a case of access
journalism
and education
shit you know active journalism going wrong and everything that michael
hastings was not
right and it's not uh...
you know there was a student that controversy that erupted over
uh... that blogger whose name i'm
lilly's case me right now but he was taking the right wing blogger who is
taking money from the malaysian government artists mere opposition
figures podcast review just checking out
and this is not
you know and everybody recognized i mean i remember i i did some t_v_ hat on that
every that was universally recognized as being completely uh... you know
ethically dubious that that's disgusting ron well that he got caught
because he got well and also because it just wasn't as um...
as subtle
as these other arrangements are and i think that that's why these arrangements
or
probably even more are even more problematic is also no espy's points
there's also no one that we're trying to edit america wants trying to apply for
asylum in croatia and they're using intelligent yeah
within however where wait a minute let me rebutted
say something about that the other side of the following this pretty closely and
eva trevino pick you know it's one of those each just like the one of the
worst
didn't things i've ever encountered say the internet in my life is like you're
catholic i worked in like a
ne film that you accidentally come across when you like when he treats
jackie looks like
persistence
blind for the day
uh... i mean
and i look at it
although that certainly come across the fields but a
i am so i wouldn't really getting any appears when the story came out the
first of all i think this was alone
story by roti gray and biography that was marketed as an exclusive it was not
an exclusive
uh... malaysian opposition bloggers ad
uh... revealed his lobbying before
well before the story idler hit the guardian when they gave up a column that
he was rocking ab the malaysian government may help them for that
instead of her his call that these israeli army to assassinate american
uh...
you know all the hippies honored by the freedom flotilla
uh... but public she did on twitter
and eventually i had just looked into the wide but
lifeblood feed running the stream historian now why were they
attacking from malaysian lobbying and it
and i would and and i
scenes from
on evidence your suggestion that
door albertson was pushing this story because she's involved
with the malaysian opposition
whereas trevino had the government account
send her an obvious it was obvious that this is another p_r_ dob
probably by the malaysian opposition
and who are they going to go to
rosie grier et and but he did ben smith because they're just acts of terrorism
journalists who won
stories
and it's just
film in so much easier for them sheila make great for them to actually hit a
lightweight operatives
like gesture the your thoughts it gives them you know and that makes them look
balanced
interview someone who burned so many enemies it's not like anyone yadav
salient balance idiots you're just ravine yeah i just have to say before we
sign off on it
later on
very briefly talked about jennifer lopez performing for the uh... turkmenistan
dictator
and in one of the pieces that somebody sent me about this uh...
uh... you know i i
the human rights uh...
uh... activist is quoted as condemning you know jennifer lopez for doing this
is our store how versus so
he's definitely remove on max this is a great piece we have it lead to on our
website
thanks mam thanks for talking
extrapolate